What does it matter? The Constitution is just a goddamned piece of paper.

Seriously, it worries me as well, but there's nothing you can do about it. In the final analysis, if they want to have a police state, they will, and you won't be able to do anything. Mind you, a police state is unnecessary, for they already have all necessary control via the media, so I doubt anything would come of it.

Want to change something? You must use force. All power comes through force or the threat of it. Attempts at changing the status quo through anything less than force do not work, unless it is something willed by those already in power. Gandhi did not win through pacifism, those in power simply decided that Britain's turn at the top was over. They could have killed Gandhi anytime they wanted, and his movement would have gone dead cold. Sad truth of life.

P.S.: I'm not advocating overthrow of the government, chiefly because I don't trust any of the kind of people who would.

atomjacked wrote:

I was trained to follow orders. If I was ordered to shoot unarmed American civilians, I would. If you join the armed forces of the United States and you are not prepared to do this, you probably should not have joined. .

I can respect you staying true to your orders, for that often is the requirement of honor. You and I have clearly different honor codes, but such is life.

Would this action not conflict with the oath you took? From my view anyone giving such an order would be a domestic enemy to the Constitution.

ToGdor wrote:

atomjacked wrote: I was trained to follow orders. If I was ordered to shoot unarmed American civilians, I would. If you join the armed forces of the United States and you are not prepared to do this, you probably should not have joined. Why has nobody been seriously fucking disgusted at this throughout this whole thread? The whole "I can respect you follow orders" and "I can sort of empathize" bullshit is a cause for fucking concern.

I can respect it because I live my life by my honor, which often leads to having to do things I don't like. That's what honor is, being true to your word. For an extreme example, say my brother turned out to be a kiddy diddler. I would be honor bound to kill him. One, in retaliation for the victimized children, and two because I don't snitch. I wouldn't want to do it, but I would have to. Failure to live up to your word results in a loss of power, and karmic injury on top of it.

FWIW, I too am disgusted at the thought of an American soldier shooting unarmed Americans. Like I said though, I can respect it, even while being disgusted.