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I have a serious question about gender reputation


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HardcoreGamer4Ever
Title: I Am The God Of Awesome
Joined: Jun 28 2010
Location: Your Mom's Vagina!
PostPosted: Dec 26 2010 01:59 am Reply with quote Back to top

Hopefully this doesn't get locked, deleted, or thrown into the Abandoned Fairgrounds. You see, I've noticed something strange: Whenever a teenage girl has sex with a lot of people or supposedly has sex with a lot of people, she get's a bad reputation and labels like "slut" and "whore". However, when a teenage boy has sex with a lot of people or supposedly has sex with a lot of people, his reputation goes up and people think he's cool. Example. "You're the man. You totally boned her last night!" Now, I want to know why there is such a big difference in gender reputation. In fact, why are men still treated better than women in today's society? What are your thoughts? My theory is that it's just been a male dominated world since the very first humans and we're still holding on to these primitive traditions.


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Drew Linky
Wizard
Joined: Jun 12 2009
PostPosted: Dec 26 2010 02:17 am Reply with quote Back to top

Put simply, men typically hold more power than women. In sex, however, the woman is the person who holds the power. If she says no, it means no. You have no say in it unless you want to be a rapist. If you can get some, people will respect you because its supposed to be some monumental achievement. But if you're a woman and dole it out like its going of style, then you're going to get called a whore because you're making it too easy, or something (don't really understand THAT part...).

That's how I see it, anyway.


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FNJ
2010 SLF Tag Champ
Joined: Jun 07 2006
PostPosted: Dec 26 2010 03:14 am Reply with quote Back to top

when one key opens multiple doors, it's a master key. when one lock is opened by many keys, it's a shitty lock.


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Dr. Jeebus
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Title: SLF Harbinger of Death
Joined: Sep 03 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
PostPosted: Dec 26 2010 03:41 am Reply with quote Back to top

The sex thing is simple: Men can't get pregnant. No matter what angle you approach this from, that's what it comes down to.


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Vaenamoenen
Joined: Mar 18 2010
Location: Tuonela
PostPosted: Dec 26 2010 03:43 am Reply with quote Back to top

Obvious, but true. This has to do with expectations people have. What does it mean to be a "good woman" etc. Cultural meanings.

An anthropologist would say, that sex is globally one of the most forbidden things there is. It's a taboo, that is considered "okay" only with special permission - of which marriage is the usual example. There's more taboos associated with women. Like, we feel a bit uncomfortable talking about menstruation etc. In the same line of thought, a woman having sex is thought to be a bigger issue. Corny, unfair, but almost universal.
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UsaSatsui
Title: The White Rabbit
Joined: May 25 2008
Location: Hiding
PostPosted: Dec 26 2010 04:21 am Reply with quote Back to top

Dr. Jeebus wrote:
The sex thing is simple: Men can't get pregnant. No matter what angle you approach this from, that's what it comes down to.

You know, there's a whole bunch of theories and studies and psychology and everything on this subject, but I'm gonna have to agree this is what it all comes down to.
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pineapple
Joined: Nov 11 2009
Location: Cajun Country
PostPosted: Dec 26 2010 05:42 am Reply with quote Back to top

FNJ wrote:
when one key opens multiple doors, it's a master key. when one lock is opened by many keys, it's a shitty lock.

Came in here to post this.
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SoldierHawk
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Title: Warrior-Poet
Joined: Jan 15 2009
Location: San Diego, CA
PostPosted: Dec 26 2010 05:53 am Reply with quote Back to top

UsaSatsui wrote:
Dr. Jeebus wrote:
The sex thing is simple: Men can't get pregnant. No matter what angle you approach this from, that's what it comes down to.

You know, there's a whole bunch of theories and studies and psychology and everything on this subject, but I'm gonna have to agree this is what it all comes down to.

Mayhaps I'm being thick, but I'm not getting the connection between this physiological fact and the perception differences pointed out by the OP.

Drew Linky wrote:
Put simply, men typically hold more power than women. In sex, however, the woman is the person who holds the power. If she says no, it means no. You have no say in it unless you want to be a rapist. If you can get some, people will respect you because its supposed to be some monumental achievement. But if you're a woman and dole it out like its going of style, then you're going to get called a whore because you're making it too easy, or something (don't really understand THAT part...).

That's how I see it, anyway.

I think there's definitely some basis to this, but women having significantly more power in the sex arena can't be the ONLY issue. The whore vs. player dichotomy was going on long before women had any power in the bedroom at all. Nathanial Hawthorne was writing about it in the 17th century, when women were essentially owned by their husbands and used at their pleasure.


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UsaSatsui
Title: The White Rabbit
Joined: May 25 2008
Location: Hiding
PostPosted: Dec 26 2010 06:30 am Reply with quote Back to top

SoldierHawk wrote:
UsaSatsui wrote:
Dr. Jeebus wrote:
The sex thing is simple: Men can't get pregnant. No matter what angle you approach this from, that's what it comes down to.

You know, there's a whole bunch of theories and studies and psychology and everything on this subject, but I'm gonna have to agree this is what it all comes down to.

Mayhaps I'm being thick, but I'm not getting the connection between this physiological fact and the perception differences pointed out by the OP.

Some quick, partially relevant possibilities: Men feel women need to be protected because of this; men are jealous because of this; Because a woman could get pregnant she should be "more careful" with sex; Men don't like it when women sleep around because they want to make sure any babies that pop up are theirs.
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Pandajuice
Title: The Power of Grayskull
Joined: Oct 30 2008
Location: US and UK
PostPosted: Dec 26 2010 07:27 am Reply with quote Back to top

Most of our social history, and indeed current cultures, was based on virginity and chastity before marriage. It's still a pretty prevalent and recent ideal too so a woman who isn't chaste is seen as a Delilah or temptress, even in today's society. There's also a lot of pressure put on women by other women so the "slut" thing just makes good ammunition for two women who dislike each other.

That social expectation was never put on men, and in fact, a lot of pressure still comes down on adolescent boys from their peers to lose their virginity as quickly as possible; it's our culture's rite of passage for boys to become men. Also for most mammals, being the alpha male means having a lot of mates and despite our homes and society, we're still base mammals after all. The male with the most women and biggest muscles is the more powerful one.

So there's the difference. As enlightened as we are in 2010, both standards harken back to our primitive, built-in ideals as humans and animals.
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FNJ
2010 SLF Tag Champ
Joined: Jun 07 2006
PostPosted: Dec 26 2010 01:05 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I'm sorry that I can't contribute more to the intelligent conversation here, but when women use the same bathrooms and changing rooms as men, I'll worry more about perceptions of equality.


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Atma
Title: Dragoon
Joined: Apr 29 2010
Location: Cincinnati, OH
PostPosted: Dec 26 2010 01:25 pm Reply with quote Back to top

FNJ wrote:
when one key opens multiple doors, it's a master key. when one lock is opened by many keys, it's a shitty lock.

This is amazing.
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Natsu
Joined: Sep 17 2010
PostPosted: Dec 26 2010 01:39 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I agree with Jeebus for a girl it's high risk to have sex, for a guy the risk is very low. So a guy wants to take it whenever he can, and a girl needs to be choosy because they could end up with a child, and they want to have it with someone worth having it with.

To get into more the evolutionary psychology to the answer men will naturally have a drive to have sex with anything in sight because that maximizes their odds for them to have offspring, and those men who had that drive were more likely to have kids than those who did not. Women on the other hand have the opposite effect because if they let themselves just get pregnant by any man, then the likelihood of their child's survival will go down, compared to the woman who just have kids with responsible family oriented males. So the girls are naturally picky, and the guys are naturally not picky. (they can keep having kids one after the other, the girl only get 1 per 9 months, they have to make it count. The guy's best bet is have as many as possible).

There is some social aspects that vary from society to society, but that's the biological drive behind it.
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GPFontaine
Joined: Dec 06 2007
Location: Connecticut
PostPosted: Dec 26 2010 01:54 pm Reply with quote Back to top

In the "old days" I have no doubt that Jeebus was correct. Since DNA testing has been invented though, I disagree. A guy popping out kids is going to get screwed.

At this point though, I think that most people don't have the perspective any longer that a guy is cool for having sex with lots of girls especially unprotected.

The majority of society wouldn't high five a guy or a girl for having unprotected sex. Sure, some guys might feel like it is a cool thing to endorse, but I doubt most actually feel that way.

As for having multiple partners, guys might encourage other guys to go and sleep around as much as they can, but I don't think that most girls want a male slut, at least not girls who are worth being with in a relationship.

So in the end I think there are three major categories, and of course people who fall between them.

1. People who want sex without relationships
2. People who want sex with relationships
3. People who can't seem to get sex with or without a relationship (paying for it puts you in this category)

I would assume that most people who fall into category 1, think it is cool to sleep around with as many partners as they can. Also, they would probably sleep with women who they thought were "sluts"... or their equals in sexual conquest.

Most people in category 2 would avoid people in category 1 as sexual partners. This group is the one that defines category 1 as sluts.

People in category 3 will sleep with either everyone or no one. The issue for them is usually that they don't have the opportunity.

No matter which category a person falls into, I think that most people usually feel that the grass is always greener on the other side, except for people in 1 or 2 looking at 3. There is no grass over there.



 
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Drew Linky
Wizard
Joined: Jun 12 2009
PostPosted: Dec 26 2010 11:54 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Natsu wrote:
I agree with Jeebus for a girl it's high risk to have sex, for a guy the risk is very low. So a guy wants to take it whenever he can, and a girl needs to be choosy because they could end up with a child, and they want to have it with someone worth having it with.

About this: did you know that statistically, women contract more STDs than men?


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lavalarva
2011 SNES Champ
Joined: Dec 04 2006
PostPosted: Dec 27 2010 12:31 am Reply with quote Back to top

That's because women are more vulnerable to STDs.
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FNJ
2010 SLF Tag Champ
Joined: Jun 07 2006
PostPosted: Dec 27 2010 12:41 am Reply with quote Back to top

because they are whores?


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Drew Linky
Wizard
Joined: Jun 12 2009
PostPosted: Dec 27 2010 12:41 am Reply with quote Back to top

lavalarva wrote:
That's because women are more vulnerable to STDs.

Photobucket

Isn't that what I just said?

Probably not, but I couldn't resist. The picture makes me laugh.


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FNJ
2010 SLF Tag Champ
Joined: Jun 07 2006
PostPosted: Dec 27 2010 12:43 am Reply with quote Back to top

it actually had me giggling as well.


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TheRoboSleuth
Title: Sleuth Mark IV
Joined: Aug 08 2006
Location: The Gritty Future
PostPosted: Dec 27 2010 03:02 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Drew Linky wrote:
Natsu wrote:
I agree with Jeebus for a girl it's high risk to have sex, for a guy the risk is very low. So a guy wants to take it whenever he can, and a girl needs to be choosy because they could end up with a child, and they want to have it with someone worth having it with.

About this: did you know that statistically, women contract more STDs than men?
obviously, I mean one guy with herpes can make quite a few rounds.


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Preng
Title: All right, that's cool!
Joined: Jan 11 2010
Location: Accounting Dept.
PostPosted: Dec 27 2010 04:52 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Hello, everyone. Here are a few topics I'd like to share regarding gender expectations and sexuality in general. I apologize if this writing seems scatterbrained, if it does not transition well, or if there is redundancy; I used my Human Sexuality class textbook, chock full of study findings and research statistics, to bring up some interesting points you may or may not have noticed before. Since I basically flipped back and forth between chapters and segments, it might not be arranged in the best method for your reading. However, the goal is for you to learn something. I realize we are, largely, all adults, I am not exactly trying to change your entire world of thinking or force you to accept my opinions. Still, do your best to read these topics with an open mind.

Gender Expectations, Roles, and Behaviors

Cultural gender stereotypes are the beliefs about gender roles held by a majority of people in a given cultural setting and communicated through parenting, schooling, mass media, literature, and advertising. Every single day, we all experience hundreds of advertisements, and I feel that most of them quietly or significantly reinforce cultural gender stereotypes. However, your personal gender stereotypes are unique to you alone and may not reflect that of a culture's.

Some quick facts from studies in 1994 and 2003 (please note that, of course, this does not apply to each gender in 100% of cases!):

-Women focus more on the relationship aspects of sexual activities; men have a more physical or recreational orientation toward sexuality.
-Men are more tolerant than women of casual sexual encounters.
-A greater number of men than women masturbate, and men masturbate more frequently.
-Men are more likely than women to be accepting of premarital sex and tend to feel less guilty having it.
-Men are less disapproving than women of extramarital sexual behaviors.
-Men think about sex more often than women on a daily basis.
-Men are more likely than women to engage in intercourse without an emotional attachment.
-Men are more likely than women to assume that others are interested in sex.
-When describing sexual experiences, women are more likely to romanticize them, while men are more likely to sexualize them.
-Women tend to see the goals of sex as building intimacy and expressing
-Men have stronger sexual drive and desire than women.

Again, these findings are simply not true for every person in every given scenario. However, I would say that from these studies, men are, to some extent, more promiscuous than women. Whether or not you do not wish to accept this, or even if you think this is obvious, I believe that most media sources understand this and, to put it plainly, give us what we want to see in television shows and advertisements. This is even true in young children's television shows, where male characters are much more likely than female characters to find solutions to problems.

Although exceptions exist, here is a list of the central findings of research on the content of most television programming, including commercials, as it relates to gender (Studies from 2002 and 2005):

-Men are usually more dominant than women in male-female conversations.
-Men are often portrayed as rational, ambitious, smart, competitive, powerful, stable, violent, and tolerant; women are portrayed as sensitive, romantic, attractive, happy, warm, sociable, peaceful, fair, submissive, and timid.
-Television programming emphasizes male characters' strength, performance, and skill; for women, it focuses on attractiveness and desirability.
-Marriage and family are not as important to men as to women in television programs. One study of TV programming found that for nearly half the men it wasn't possible to tell if they were married, a fact that was true for only 11% of the women.
-Television ads for boy-oriented products focus on action, competition, destruction, and control; television ads for girl-oriented products focus on limited activity, feelings, and nurturing.
-Approximately 65% of the characters in television programs are male.
-Men are twice as likely as women to come up with solutions to problems.
-Women are depicted as sex objects more frequently than men.
-Men are shown to be clumsy and inept in dealing with infants and children.
-Saturday morning children's programs typically feature males in dominant roles with females in supporting or peripheral roles.

Most of us are knowledgeable of traditional gender stereotypes - the man is the provider while the woman is the nurturer. Again, this is simply not true in all situations, especially when you compare our modern age to the 1950s, yet it would seem that many traditional male characteristics (independent, assertive, strong, decisive, self-confident) are typically considered desirable while traditional female characteristics (submissive, passive, emotional, talkative, fearful) are typically considered undesirable. Take a moment to decide if you agree or disagree. I feel that all of these characteristics have their benefits and drawbacks which do not necessarily make them completely good or bad. Also, of course, this does not mean that only men can be assertive or that only women can be talkative, and so on. I would say that if you do, in fact, believe that all of the traditional male characteristics are desirable while the traditional female characteristics are undesirable, you are viewing genders through dangerous stereotypes!

In most cases, the media we witness and the advertisements we see on a day-to-day basis reinforce such stereotypes. I do not believe this is healthy. Gender stereotypes continue to influence people's choices of occupations, as well as how they view the opposite gender in general.

Sexually Transmitted Infections

Many STIs are asymptomatic, meaning they may produce no noticeable symptoms at all, especially in women. But the lack of symptoms does not imply the lack of infection. Infected people who are asymptomatic are capable of unknowingly transmitting the infection to their sexual partners. In addition, these infected individuals are unlikely to seek testing or treatment because they show no signs of illness. Without treatment virtually all STIs will become increasingly serious over time and can lead to additional health problems.

Males and females aged 10-24 acquire almost 50% of all new STIs! There are many suggestions for this, such as the lack of STI symptoms (explained above), lack of accurate information (parents, through with good intentions, do not properly educate their young about sexual risks; however, people of all ages are rather uneducated about the risks of STIs because of poor information sources as well as abstinence-only school programs which show poorer results against full sexual education programs; most teenagers do not think that oral sex is 'true' sex and thus cannot pass on STIs, which is horribly incorrect), unhealthy sexual emotions (fear of being stigmatized and avoiding getting tested), poor sexual communication, and substance abuse (alcohol and drugs don't fucking mix with good decisions about sex!). Although most people are aware that male/female condoms can help (but not at a 100% rate) prevent STI transmission, males do not consistently practice safe sex. I cannot find the exact statistics, but about one quarter of college males have never used a condom, and less than half of those who have fail to use them consistently.

Works Cited

Hock, Roger R. Human Sexuality. 2nd ed. Upper Saddle River: Prentice Hall, 2010. Print.
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SoldierHawk
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Title: Warrior-Poet
Joined: Jan 15 2009
Location: San Diego, CA
PostPosted: Dec 27 2010 06:19 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Nice post, Preng. It'll take some time to absorb all that...


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TheRoboSleuth
Title: Sleuth Mark IV
Joined: Aug 08 2006
Location: The Gritty Future
PostPosted: Dec 27 2010 07:38 pm Reply with quote Back to top

The post by my lame clone preng is not as good as FNJ's witty key based metaphor, which is short, has punch, and leads into great "master of unlocking" jokes.


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i'll_bite_your_ear
Title: Distillatoria
Joined: Jun 09 2010
Location: van down by the river
PostPosted: Dec 28 2010 06:07 am Reply with quote Back to top

i have no idea why woman get mistreated, i only know how to change that and that is by treating women good.


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it was the blurst of times
 
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Preng
Title: All right, that's cool!
Joined: Jan 11 2010
Location: Accounting Dept.
PostPosted: Dec 28 2010 01:04 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I laughed at FNJ's post, and there is definitely some truth in Jeebus's post, but I figured the good jokes were already made, so I might as well give a serious answer to a serious question.

The greater question, however, is what you and I, robotic units from the 70s and 90s, respectively, are doing in a human sexuality thread in the first place!
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