Author |
Message |
Syd Lexia
Site Admin
Title: Pop Culture Junkie
Joined: Jul 30 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
Posts: 24886
|
One of the things that President Barack has been pushing for is an extended school year, citing that our students lag behind those of other countries. Thing is, our students don't go to school for significantly less time than students in most other countries. The problem is that we need better curriculums, better teachers, and honestly, better students. Too many low income students come into the school system with disrespectful attitudes, and no desire to learn or study. Like Ivan Drago, we must break them. I don't know what the solution is for them. Perhaps there should be extended school hours just for underperforming students. But we don't need to fuck over our entire youth culture just because some people suck.
I have to say, I'm very disturbed at the recent pushes to overregulate our children. Kids mature faster today than ever before, but over the last 10 years, Massachusetts has imposed all sorts of new restrictions on new drivers. Most recently, they've been debating raising the driving age to 17.
What really pisses me off is that legislators don't give a shit about kids and teens, because they can't vote. No one is advocating for them, so most of this stuff ends up passing because it makes old people feel better about their withered penises, dry vaginas, and failing livers.
Congress, leave them kids alone.
|
|
|
     |
|
GPFontaine
Joined: Dec 06 2007
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 11244
|
At what point is humanity is destroyed by conformity. Part of the learning process is the time and experience in the real world where the information consumed can be put to use. Extending school further will make people better at Math and English at the expense of personal creativity and modern day survival skills.
I actually think that the lack of recess during school sessions hurts kids and to further that effort by reducing breaks from institutionalized education would compound the problem.
Syd, I will disagree with you that the children are underachieving. I think that the parents are underachieving. It takes a good parent to recognize when their child needs help and to follow through with the necessary steps and provide that support.
|
|
|
   |
|
blkplaguelmc
Joined: May 13 2009
Location: lowell, ma
Posts: 289
|
I think America never realizes that we have people from every country in the world here and maybe thats why we suck at a lot of things. Other countries have discipline, we have immigrants. I'm not racist by any means, but I would guarantee our test scores or whatever have gone down significantly say in the last 30-40 years (when most of the immigrants we have now came). I think its just how America is, we're a melting pot of a country and a young one to. I don't think what we do is really done in any other country, meaning having a country almost entirely made up of people who technically aren't even really from here. I'd say the reason we've done bad with school compared to other countries is because no other country is like ours. We have the most freedom, so of course people are gonna be douchebags and end up having bad attitudes about shit like school(if they don't want to be there)
Also GP, I completely agree with you. The blame should go to the parents. If a kid doesn't have a good parent to push and be there for a them then I think the last thing on their mind would be understanding the importance of school. Certainly not in every case, but in most.
|
|
|
   |
|
Captain_Pollution
Title: Hugh
Joined: Sep 23 2007
Posts: 1591
|
Umm.... we have a shitfuck of immigrants up here, too. And all my Canadian propoganda social studies classes tought me that while you guys were a melting pot, we were just multicultural. Your culture is formed by the homogenization of all the cultures that make you up, whereas ours is more just a collection of different cultures. As well, I don't really understand your argument. You said that other countries have discipline, but the marks have been going down since all the immigrants came. If you Americans don't have discipline, and they do, wouldn't they be rising? Or if you're arguing that since it's a melting pot, they lose their disciplines upon coming here, then still, wouldn't they only be dropping to your level?
And yeah, I think good parents are definitely the most important aspect. We need more good teachers, also, though. Way too many teachers don't put in that same effort they ask of the parents and a lot of them give up on certain kids. The kids that are harder to reach should be gone after more, not abandoned. Sure the teachers would end up wasting some time on kids that they would never reach, but you can get to anyone if you know how. After they'd practised a while, they'd probably get better at knowing how to help. While the parents are the more important part of the equation definitely, a good teacher can do a lot of good, whereas a bad teacher can fuck up really bad. At the point we're at, it's a lot easier to regulate who's teaching than who's parenting.
|
 <Drew_Linky> Well, I've eaten vegetables all of once in my life.
|
|
  |
|
Syd Lexia
Site Admin
Title: Pop Culture Junkie
Joined: Jul 30 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
Posts: 24886
|
Another point is that too much conformity and too many guidelines ill prepare our youth for college. The leap from too much discipline to almost none leads down the path of ruin. Nice girls turn into whores, and guys turn into drunks and potheads. There needs to be a balance. We need to raise our children in a society where they WANT to learn and we can afford them some of the choice and freedom they will receive at college at earlier ages.
Increasing class time does not prepare kids for college. In college, even a six class schedule with a lab (the standard schedule is five classes) will result in little more than half the class time of a full high school week. Kids need to learn how to study and succeed on their own or in study groups, without supervision.
|
|
|
     |
|
GPFontaine
Joined: Dec 06 2007
Location: Connecticut
Posts: 11244
|
Syd Lexia wrote: |
Another point is that too much conformity and too many guidelines ill prepare our youth for college. The leap from too much discipline to almost none leads down the path of ruin. Nice girls turn into whores, and guys turn into drunks and potheads. There needs to be a balance. We need to raise our children in a society where they WANT to learn and we can afford them some of the choice and freedom they will receive at college at earlier ages.
Increasing class time does not prepare kids for college. In college, even a six class schedule with a lab (the standard schedule is five classes) will result in little more than half the class time of a full high school week. Kids need to learn how to study and succeed on their own or in study groups, without supervision. |
What worries me the most is that American colleges are conforming too. They don't really prepare students for the real world. Internship programs and part time jobs are what prepare people for real work.
I actually think that Jr. and Sr. year of high school should advocate students taking one day a week internships more than focus on AP classes. Academia does end and the shock for too many people is huge.
|
|
|
   |
|
blkplaguelmc
Joined: May 13 2009
Location: lowell, ma
Posts: 289
|
Captain_Pollution wrote: |
Umm.... we have a shitfuck of immigrants up here, too. And all my Canadian propoganda social studies classes tought me that while you guys were a melting pot, we were just multicultural. Your culture is formed by the homogenization of all the cultures that make you up, whereas ours is more just a collection of different cultures. As well, I don't really understand your argument. You said that other countries have discipline, but the marks have been going down since all the immigrants came. If you Americans don't have discipline, and they do, wouldn't they be rising? Or if you're arguing that since it's a melting pot, they lose their disciplines upon coming here, then still, wouldn't they only be dropping to your level?
. |
Thats the thing, we have no level. There's no such thing as a real "American" unless you say Native Americans, and i'm pretty sure they didn't call this America before it was taken from them. This country is so new that we act like theres a certain way for things to be done. I don't think any country in the history of the world has had the diversity of this one. People immigrating here are sucked into this "american dream" thing. "Oh this is a free country, blah blah blah". That's where our ignorance to things come. Like pollution, hard work, and school. And i'm not trying to say all americans are like that, but theres a lot of ignorance in this country.
Also, to compare Canada to America is fucking ridiculous. You guys are like 17 times the size with like 10 times less people. I'd also be pretty sure in saying that you don't even have a tenth of the amount of immigrants that America does. SO yea I would call Canada multicultural and not a melting pot.
And Syd, your definitely right. I dunno how your highschool was, but mine sure as hell did not prepare me for college. I would say not many public ones do. You can basically skip your way through highschool and then get to college and actually have to study and not even know how.
|
|
|
   |
|
Ice2SeeYou
Title: Sexual Tyrannosaurus
Joined: Sep 28 2008
Location: South of Heaven
Posts: 1761
|
It's just another symptom of people in this country having a complete lack of foresight, and failing to take account for their actions.
Kids get bad grades, fail classes and come out of school stupid. Adults get bad credit, get themselves into debt and have their homes foreclosed upon.
|
 Sydlexia.com - Where miserable bastards meet to call each other retards. |
|
  |
|
Captain_Pollution
Title: Hugh
Joined: Sep 23 2007
Posts: 1591
|
It's evolution, baby. If you want to talk about the dead ideals of the American Dream, go read some Hunter S. All the great dreams are dead, everyone knows that. Anyway, you haven't explained why there's no level. You've said the country's new, so? You're old enough you do definitely have a lifestyle and culture. And the Canada-America comparison isn't so ridiculous. You said we had a tenth of your population and a tenth as many immigrants... that's still to scale. Also, I don't think you understand what a melting pot is, that isn't diversity. Diversity is the differences between people - variety. A melting pot is when all your individual cultures are lost and you all just turn into one homogenous mass, that is not diversity. Anyway, it's not like we're spread out evenly over the whole land. There's a reason the Garrison Mentality exists, and that's because back in the day, we were all based in our big cities far apart with little to nothing inbetween. Our country's grown off of that, and we are all focused in on the cities and towns to this day.
|
 <Drew_Linky> Well, I've eaten vegetables all of once in my life.
|
|
  |
|
blkplaguelmc
Joined: May 13 2009
Location: lowell, ma
Posts: 289
|
Captain_Pollution wrote: |
It's evolution, baby. If you want to talk about the dead ideals of the American Dream, go read some Hunter S. All the great dreams are dead, everyone knows that. Anyway, you haven't explained why there's no level. You've said the country's new, so? You're old enough you do definitely have a lifestyle and culture. And the Canada-America comparison isn't so ridiculous. You said we had a tenth of your population and a tenth as many immigrants... that's still to scale. Also, I don't think you understand what a melting pot is, that isn't diversity. Diversity is the differences between people - variety. A melting pot is when all your individual cultures are lost and you all just turn into one homogenous mass, that is not diversity. Anyway, it's not like we're spread out evenly over the whole land. There's a reason the Garrison Mentality exists, and that's because back in the day, we were all based in our big cities far apart with little to nothing inbetween. Our country's grown off of that, and we are all focused in on the cities and towns to this day. |
I just don't think you can compare America to any other country because theres none like it. I don't think you can scale Canadas immirgants to Americas either. There's not only way more but i'd say there probably a lot more different races of immigrants then what Canada has, so I don't think comparing the 2 would really do anything. It's not like I have the demographics in front of me but i'm pretty sure.
|
|
|
   |
|
Captain_Pollution
Title: Hugh
Joined: Sep 23 2007
Posts: 1591
|
I didn't scale them, you did. And again, you're assuming, I'm going by my years of Canadian propoganda social studies classes. They always, always said we were significantly more diversified than you guys, lots more cultures, and the immigrants kept them up here.
And you haven't answered, what's so special about America?
|
 <Drew_Linky> Well, I've eaten vegetables all of once in my life.
|
|
  |
|
Ice2SeeYou
Title: Sexual Tyrannosaurus
Joined: Sep 28 2008
Location: South of Heaven
Posts: 1761
|
Captain_Pollution wrote: |
And you haven't answered, what's so special about America? |
We gave the world Hulk Hogan and Mr T.
|
 Sydlexia.com - Where miserable bastards meet to call each other retards. |
|
  |
|
anorexorcist
Title: Polar Bear
Joined: May 21 2008
Location: The Cock and Plucket
Posts: 2131
|
blkplaguelmc wrote: |
Captain_Pollution wrote: |
It's evolution, baby. If you want to talk about the dead ideals of the American Dream, go read some Hunter S. All the great dreams are dead, everyone knows that. Anyway, you haven't explained why there's no level. You've said the country's new, so? You're old enough you do definitely have a lifestyle and culture. And the Canada-America comparison isn't so ridiculous. You said we had a tenth of your population and a tenth as many immigrants... that's still to scale. Also, I don't think you understand what a melting pot is, that isn't diversity. Diversity is the differences between people - variety. A melting pot is when all your individual cultures are lost and you all just turn into one homogenous mass, that is not diversity. Anyway, it's not like we're spread out evenly over the whole land. There's a reason the Garrison Mentality exists, and that's because back in the day, we were all based in our big cities far apart with little to nothing inbetween. Our country's grown off of that, and we are all focused in on the cities and towns to this day. |
I just don't think you can compare America to any other country because theres none like it. I don't think you can scale Canadas immirgants to Americas either. There's not only way more but i'd say there probably a lot more different races of immigrants then what Canada has, so I don't think comparing the 2 would really do anything. It's not like I have the demographics in front of me but i'm pretty sure. |
Have you ever even been to Canada? We have a ton of immigrants. Fewer from the South and Central Americas but we have a ton from eastern europe. When the war in Serbia started, a lot of Serbs came over, at least in my area we are extremely diverse.
Canada and the whole of the UK are comparable to the US. You talk about how there is ignorance in the US? I think you are demonstating ignorance quite well.
|
 Lawyers, Guns and Money |
|
   |
|
Deadmau_5pra
Title: Amatuer film/podcaster
Joined: Feb 10 2009
Location: Chicago Area
Posts: 1126
|
Ice2SeeYou wrote: |
Captain_Pollution wrote: |
And you haven't answered, what's so special about America? |
We gave the world Hulk Hogan and Mr T. |
We gave them Mcdonalds, and if they don't want it, give them back!
|
|
|
  |
|
Bouya
Title: Delinquent
Joined: Aug 15 2007
Location: Suzuran
Posts: 1443
|
I don't wanna turn it into some political debate, but the problem with education has been the total liberal shift of the entire educational establishment. It went from just being "keep god out of the classroom", which makes sense, to this thing now where everything and anything goes. I can accept that for college, because there's such varied fields of study and colleges are "the arena of ideas" or whatever, but K-12 should be a place that prepares you for the real world with no sugar coating.
I'd do uniforms, entrance and exit exams, and put a cap on how many kids can go to a class. I'd also have some sort of tutoring program, which I know my school sure didn't have. And I'd put a huge stress on college, because I wasn't given any sort of push in that direction aside from "take college prep and AP courses", which I did, but then I didn't know where to go from there.
I think there's ways to have strict rules and guidelines in place, but also have school be a good memory for people. And I don't think having strict schools does anything to mess with someone's creativity. Japan's education system is all rigid, but look at the messed up shit that comes out of that country. If anything, it's made their imaginations even more active.
Oh, and syd: driving age should be 18 across the entire globe. And in outer space.
|
|
|
  |
|
Deadmau_5pra
Title: Amatuer film/podcaster
Joined: Feb 10 2009
Location: Chicago Area
Posts: 1126
|
Japan's suicide rate of as of January 2009 : 2,645.
Damn.....
|
|
|
  |
|
blkplaguelmc
Joined: May 13 2009
Location: lowell, ma
Posts: 289
|
anorexorcist wrote: |
blkplaguelmc wrote: |
Captain_Pollution wrote: |
It's evolution, baby. If you want to talk about the dead ideals of the American Dream, go read some Hunter S. All the great dreams are dead, everyone knows that. Anyway, you haven't explained why there's no level. You've said the country's new, so? You're old enough you do definitely have a lifestyle and culture. And the Canada-America comparison isn't so ridiculous. You said we had a tenth of your population and a tenth as many immigrants... that's still to scale. Also, I don't think you understand what a melting pot is, that isn't diversity. Diversity is the differences between people - variety. A melting pot is when all your individual cultures are lost and you all just turn into one homogenous mass, that is not diversity. Anyway, it's not like we're spread out evenly over the whole land. There's a reason the Garrison Mentality exists, and that's because back in the day, we were all based in our big cities far apart with little to nothing inbetween. Our country's grown off of that, and we are all focused in on the cities and towns to this day. |
Sheesh, I didn't mean to offend Canadians by saying the US has more and diverse immigrants (is that really offensive). But, it is pretty much a fact due to the size and the number of different races in the US. I don't think i
I just don't think you can compare America to any other country because theres none like it. I don't think you can scale Canadas immirgants to Americas either. There's not only way more but i'd say there probably a lot more different races of immigrants then what Canada has, so I don't think comparing the 2 would really do anything. It's not like I have the demographics in front of me but i'm pretty sure. |
Have you ever even been to Canada? We have a ton of immigrants. Fewer from the South and Central Americas but we have a ton from eastern europe. When the war in Serbia started, a lot of Serbs came over, at least in my area we are extremely diverse.
Canada and the whole of the UK are comparable to the US. You talk about how there is ignorance in the US? I think you are demonstating ignorance quite well. |
Sheesh, I didn't mean to offend Canadians by saying the US has more diverse immigrants (is that really offensive). But, it is pretty much a fact due to the size and the number of different races in the US. I don't think i'm being ignorant either, this was never intended to become a pissing contest of what country has more what. I was just giving my opinion on why the US has been doing so bad with the school system and it turned into something more than it was. My apologies, I love Bret Hart, I love wonderland, whats their not to like about Canada??
|
|
|
   |
|
Syd Lexia
Site Admin
Title: Pop Culture Junkie
Joined: Jul 30 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
Posts: 24886
|
I don't think uniforms should be required K-12 because, again, uniforms don't prepare you for college.
|
|
|
     |
|
Bouya
Title: Delinquent
Joined: Aug 15 2007
Location: Suzuran
Posts: 1443
|
Syd Lexia wrote: |
I don't think uniforms should be required K-12 because, again, uniforms don't prepare you for college. |
That's assuming everyone was going to go to college. Some simply won't try, and others won't make it in. Uniform serves to prepare you for workplace life where you have a dress code, and takes away from people dressing stupid to get a reaction or to make the news. Less distractions.
|
|
|
  |
|
Dr. Jeebus
Moderator
Title: SLF Harbinger of Death
Joined: Sep 03 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
Posts: 5228
|
Syd Lexia wrote: |
I don't think uniforms should be required K-12 because, again, uniforms don't prepare you for college. |
Do you also think that every health center (or nurse's office) in every K-12 school should have a tray of free condoms since that will prepare them for college? You shouldn't treat a fucking 5 year old like they're going to college the next day: college students are adults and K-12 students are children. They should be treated differently and have different rules.
|
dr.jeebus.sydlexia.com - Updated sometimes, but on hiatus!
UsaSatsui wrote: |
The three greatest heels in history...Andy Kaufman, Triple H, and Dr. Jeebus |
|
|
     |
|
Bouya
Title: Delinquent
Joined: Aug 15 2007
Location: Suzuran
Posts: 1443
|
Man, if I could've had some free condoms when I had the hots for DeAnna Haylett in like 1984... I would've been 7, so they wouldn't have done much good.
|
|
|
  |
|
JRA
Joined: Sep 17 2007
Location: The Opium Trail
Posts: 3475
|
Congress should spend less time on kids and more time figuring out which corporations have stolen money.
|
 There are a lot of what if's in life Donny. What if I hit you really hard in the face, knocked yo shit to the back of yo skull? What if I....had you girl gargle my nuts? The fact remains, you are a fuckin mutant. |
|
  |
|
Bouya
Title: Delinquent
Joined: Aug 15 2007
Location: Suzuran
Posts: 1443
|
JRA wrote: |
Congress should spend less time on kids and more time figuring out which congressman have stolen money. |
Fixed.
|
|
|
  |
|
anorexorcist
Title: Polar Bear
Joined: May 21 2008
Location: The Cock and Plucket
Posts: 2131
|
blkplaguelmc wrote: |
anorexorcist wrote: |
blkplaguelmc wrote: |
Captain_Pollution wrote: |
It's evolution, baby. If you want to talk about the dead ideals of the American Dream, go read some Hunter S. All the great dreams are dead, everyone knows that. Anyway, you haven't explained why there's no level. You've said the country's new, so? You're old enough you do definitely have a lifestyle and culture. And the Canada-America comparison isn't so ridiculous. You said we had a tenth of your population and a tenth as many immigrants... that's still to scale. Also, I don't think you understand what a melting pot is, that isn't diversity. Diversity is the differences between people - variety. A melting pot is when all your individual cultures are lost and you all just turn into one homogenous mass, that is not diversity. Anyway, it's not like we're spread out evenly over the whole land. There's a reason the Garrison Mentality exists, and that's because back in the day, we were all based in our big cities far apart with little to nothing inbetween. Our country's grown off of that, and we are all focused in on the cities and towns to this day. |
Sheesh, I didn't mean to offend Canadians by saying the US has more and diverse immigrants (is that really offensive). But, it is pretty much a fact due to the size and the number of different races in the US. I don't think i
I just don't think you can compare America to any other country because theres none like it. I don't think you can scale Canadas immirgants to Americas either. There's not only way more but i'd say there probably a lot more different races of immigrants then what Canada has, so I don't think comparing the 2 would really do anything. It's not like I have the demographics in front of me but i'm pretty sure. |
Have you ever even been to Canada? We have a ton of immigrants. Fewer from the South and Central Americas but we have a ton from eastern europe. When the war in Serbia started, a lot of Serbs came over, at least in my area we are extremely diverse.
Canada and the whole of the UK are comparable to the US. You talk about how there is ignorance in the US? I think you are demonstating ignorance quite well. |
Sheesh, I didn't mean to offend Canadians by saying the US has more diverse immigrants (is that really offensive). But, it is pretty much a fact due to the size and the number of different races in the US. I don't think i'm being ignorant either, this was never intended to become a pissing contest of what country has more what. I was just giving my opinion on why the US has been doing so bad with the school system and it turned into something more than it was. My apologies, I love Bret Hart, I love wonderland, whats their not to like about Canada?? |
It's not offensive, some people just talk like since they live in the states, then they know it's different, even if they don't know what other countries are like. Neither I nor Captain are offended.
You also never answered Captain Pollutions question about what makes the US special. There isn't a huge difference between the US and Canada besides population so saying the US's problem is multiple cultures is a little bit redundant.
You also talk about how new the US is, as far as I can remember the US has been an independant country longer than Canada.
|
 Lawyers, Guns and Money |
|
   |
|
Bouya
Title: Delinquent
Joined: Aug 15 2007
Location: Suzuran
Posts: 1443
|
Bret Hart lives on Hawaii. We imported him. Now if we just get Trish Stratus, the power shift will be complete.
|
|
|
  |
|
|
|