SydLexia.com - The Forums :: View topic - Did anybody not like the 1989 Batman movie

Joined: Sep 17 2007 Location: The Opium Trail Posts: 3475

For me the biggest problem was Jack Nicholson. He basically played it like it was Jack Nicholson in Joker make up.

Posted: Jan 10 2009 11:45 am

It has it's moments. My questions is why in the fuck does Best Buy not carry it. They've got every other batman even the craptastic 60's batman and robin movie, but no batman 1 or 2. WTF?! Mad

Posted: Jan 10 2009 11:54 am

I love Tim Burton's Batman. Only thing I don't like is the use of Prince music in the movie. I love Prince, but it doesn't fit the style or tone of the movie at all.

Joined: Dec 06 2007 Location: Connecticut Posts: 11244

I thought the movie was great.

I enjoyed it very much, including Jack Nicholson.

Posted: Jan 10 2009 01:27 pm

I never liked it. It was too weird and creepy for me, and still is. It just doesn't feel like Batman for some reason, especially after Nolan's reboot has completely nailed it in my opinion.

Also, I agree with the assertion that Jack Nicholson's Joker is less than stellar and not much of a departure from his normal personality, and I get physically upset every time I hear or read someone state he was the best Joker. Since Mark Hamill's characterization in the animated series, and Heath Ledger absolutely invoking every minor detail that makes the Joker such a badass villain, it's shocking to me that anyone can say Nicholson was still the best.

Posted: Jan 10 2009 01:33 pm

IIRC Kevin Smith had some problems with it. When Tim Burton said he'd never read a comic book, Smith responded with something like "Well, that explains Batman."

Posted: Jan 10 2009 01:39 pm

I dunno. I think the Burton film nailed the Joker pretty well. He was psychotic but often corny. I mean, come on, in the comics one of his trademarks was lethal laughing gas.

The film, however, did not nail Batman very well. The end of the movie where Batman kills the Joker is VERY uncharacteristic of the superhero and it really pissed me off. The Joker doesn't fucking die! Ever! He either gets away or gets locked up. Christ, everyone knows that.

Posted: Jan 10 2009 02:42 pm

Syd Lexia wrote:

I dunno. I think the Burton film nailed the Joker pretty well. He was psychotic but often corny. I mean, come on, in the comics one of his trademarks was lethal laughing gas.

The film, however, did not nail Batman very well. The end of the movie where Batman kills the Joker is VERY uncharacteristic of the superhero and it really pissed me off. The Joker doesn't fucking die! Ever! He either gets away or gets locked up. Christ, everyone knows that.

**SPOILER ALERT**

Except in The Dark Knight Returns, but that's not until Batman and the Joker are grumpy old men.

Posted: Jan 10 2009 02:46 pm

Yes. And despite being awesome, I believe DKR isn't canon either.

Joined: Aug 05 2008 Location: CA Posts: 867

My figure drawing teacher worked with Tim Burton on Mars attacks and Sleepy Hollow. It's pretty apparent that he does not like Tim Burton one bit. He keeps making jokes about him in class and calls him "the Sheep fucker". Also, he is a strong advocate of Scotch for breakfast and has a thick Scottish accent to boot.

IE: "We don't use charcoal in this class as much as other art classes, it's a wee bit too messy. And when that sheep fucker, Tim Burton asks you to concept something and you hand him a charcoal sketch you might get his pretty little hands dirty and are likely to get shit for it."

He looks a lot like this guy:

Best art teacher ever.

Joined: Apr 14 2006 Location: Lake Michigan Posts: 3332

Loved it as a kid, especially since Burton's Shtick hadn't gotten old yet.

Of course, now I feel Nolan's version is definitive and therefore much better.

Posted: Jan 10 2009 03:17 pm

I still fucking love it. "Returns" is still my favorite.

However, there's plenty of asstards commenting on that YouTube video that won't die that hate it too.

Joined: Sep 17 2007 Location: The Opium Trail Posts: 3475

Dr. Jeebus wrote:

**SPOILER ALERT**

Except in The Dark Knight Returns, but that's not until Batman and the Joker are grumpy old men.

Yea but Batman didn't actually kill the Joker in DKR. He came close but pussed out at the last second. Then the Joker broke his own neck to frame him.

Posted: Jan 10 2009 03:28 pm

Yea, I love this movie and Nicholson's performance is great, its just different from what Ledger was trying to evoke.

As far as Burton's movies go, I think Batman Returns is a little bit better because I LOVE Danny DeVito as the Penguin.

Joined: Aug 05 2008 Location: CA Posts: 867

Andrew Man wrote:

Yea, I love this movie and Nicholson's performance is great, its just different from what Ledger was trying to evoke.

As far as Burton's movies go, I think Batman Returns is a little bit better because I LOVE Danny DeVito as the Penguin.

Any movie is better with Christopher Walken.

Posted: Jan 10 2009 04:12 pm

I think the reason I like Returns more is because the Penguin lends itself better to Burton's style than the Joker does.

That and Michelle Pfeiffer in tight leather.

Posted: Jan 10 2009 04:21 pm

@ PM
Definaltey true, ever seen the rundown?

@ Tyop
Michelle Pfeiffer was indeed a very hot catwoman.

Posted: Jan 10 2009 04:21 pm

"Returns" is better because all the characters are better, the conflict is better, and there's actual drama. "Batman" is still good because of its classic archetypal storytelling. "Dark Knight", also extremely good and very very sophisticated, doesn't quite have the emotional focus that "Returns" has. "Returns" is rooted in very primal emotion, while "Dark Knight" focuses more on inner conflict. Personally, I can feel and relate more to primal over the more psychological.

Off the Jokers, Jack is great, Heath is scary great, Luke Skywalker is da bomb, Cesar is king.

Posted: Jan 10 2009 04:38 pm

For me going to the movie theatre in 1989 to see this and playing Double Dragon at the theatre brings back alot of positive nostalgia.

I still prefer Nicholson, but give me some more time with DK

Joined: Apr 14 2006 Location: Lake Michigan Posts: 3332

The only thing in Returns that was truly exceptional was Pfeiffer as Catwoman. The movie itself was ok, but too freaking weird - and that's coming from a guy who usually likes twisted shit like that. It was more of a Burton movie than a Batman movie.

BR is still of course better than 3 or 4. Even if I count how I weirdly enjoy Carrey as the Riddler because I was a huge fan of Gorshin's performance as the Riddler in the 60s, and because I like almost everything that Carrey does.

Posted: Jan 10 2009 06:01 pm

As for Nolan, Dark Knight is a fantastic movie. Batman Begins is kinda meh.

Posted: Jan 10 2009 07:03 pm

Syd Lexia wrote:

As for Nolan, Dark Knight is a fantastic movie. Batman Begins is kinda meh.

BB has a pretty terrible first act, a decent second act, and a Batman third act. My problem with it is its muddled story telling that: A). Ra's is currently attacking Gotham. B). Ra's/Scarecrow/Falcone's men stole Wayne Enterprises technology (which results in the DA's death). C). Falcone is more or less a red herring altogether and doesn't have much impact on the film.

Their biggest problem was just simply explaining the theft of the hydro-bomb thingy. There's like 3 scenes dedicated to that subplot and they're surprisingly unclear.

Edit: David S. Goyer has become the scapegoat of the film. It's his fault it has flaws. Not that Nolan makes good non-Batman movies (Insomnia mainly).

Posted: Jan 10 2009 07:24 pm

I think my main problem is that Ra's Al-Ghul wasn't even one 1/1000 as cool as he was in Batman:TAS.

And there wasn't a whole lot of action.

It's one of those movies that when it came out, you were so starved for a new Batman, especially one that was half-decent, you rushed out and saw it and you were super excited. And you came back and told everyone that it was awesome. Then a year goes by and you watch it again, and it's just not as exciting or fun. It's also not very quotable. A good movie should be quotable. Apocalypse Now is quotable.

Posted: Jan 10 2009 07:49 pm

Syd Lexia wrote:

I think my main problem is that Ra's Al-Ghul wasn't even one 1/1000 as cool as he was in Batman:TAS.

It's one of those movies that when it came out, you were so starved for a new Batman, especially one that was half-decent, you rushed out and saw it and you were super excited. And you came back and told everyone that it was awesome. Then a year goes by and you watch it again, and it's just not as exciting or fun. It's also not very quotable. A good movie should be quotable. Apocalypse Now is quotable.

I actually prefer the kinder, more fatherly Ra's than the laughing maniacal version of TAS (granted we only saw that version maybe once). Ra's was just too flamboyant to me on the animated show.

There wasn't as much action because the whole film's theme was fear. Hence, Batman resorted to stealth; something he totally forgot about in The Dark Knight (namely just showing up in the bank and later the police station). The Batmobile chase was pretty much a studio mandate and you need a big finish so the train. Oh yes, and Batman actually does some detective work in the film too. Arguably more than he does in TDK where he just had computers do all the work for him.

And if FB has taught me anything, Begins is hella quotable. I believe there's been about twenty threads of nothing but BB quoting on there.

Posted: Jan 10 2009 08:21 pm

Ra's Al-Ghul wasn't evil in TAS. He was just sort of this ambivalent immortal figure with ambiguous goals who enjoyed testing Batman. He also deeply respected Batman and wanted him to marry his daughter.

In BB, Ra's was clearly evil, fairly boring, and apparently not immortal. Then again, I guess we'll see about the latter.