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Posted: Jan 13 2009 06:50 am

http://videogames.yahoo.com/feature/nintendo-planning-friendlier-approach-to-game-difficulty/1278610

Nintendo improves video games by removing the need for critical thinking and common sense.

Posted: Jan 13 2009 07:12 am

I think giving people the option to access tutorials throughout the game is fine, so long as it is accessed from a menu and not some helper box that's constantly onscreen. I won't use it, but some people will. And if they do this, it would eliminate the need for those annoying tutorial sessions they tack on to the beginning of every goddam game they make.

The suggestion that players might be able to start a game at any point though? Fucking stupid. Especially in a story-driven game like Zelda. And like, how would that even work? Do they start with you maximum possible heart containers and every non-dungeon item that you could have acquired up to that point? If you want to play all the levels in a game, earn it. If you can't, practice. If you don't want to practice, fuck off and die. Video games are not for you.

Posted: Jan 13 2009 07:19 am

A tutorial is fine but it sounds like they're wanting to put step by step instructions for the entire game. Sure there are guides online but having the answers to every puzzle and boss fight right there on the game seems like people will be less willing to put the time and effort into figuring things out on their own. Stuck for five minutes? Well just hit that button and see the answer.

Posted: Jan 13 2009 07:37 am

That's what ruined Phantasmagoria for me. There was a skull icon in your control bar that you could click on at any time for a hint and it would tell you in no uncertain terms what to do next. Well, that and the fact there were only like 2 places in the game that you could die.

Posted: Jan 13 2009 08:41 am

Pure garbage. Even though people associate gamers as being losers, we are still champions when it comes to applying time and effort into beating games on our own for the most part. Being able to play through all parts of the game without earning is too lazy and will make the next generation of gamers all the more lazy and unmotivated. It's like Nintendo is trying to turn games into animated books... I mean hell, they might as well have you hit a button every once in a while to continue reading "Bah Bah Black Sheep" to you while you fall asleep in your own fucking drool.

Posted: Jan 13 2009 09:17 am

I think you guys are going overboard here. Yes, being able to start a game at any point is pretty gay. However, just because they patent this doesn't mean they HAVE to use it, and certainly not in every game they make. People thought that the Wiimote was a terrible idea, but they've used it extremely well for the most part. If there was any company I would ever trust to successfully enact what sounds like a stupid fucking idea, it would be Nintendo.

Syd Lexia wrote:

That's what ruined Phantasmagoria for me. There was a skull icon in your control bar that you could click on at any time for a hint and it would tell you in no uncertain terms what to do next. Well, that and the fact there were only like 2 places in the game that you could die.

You beat me to it, because this was the first thing that came to mind. "Stop dicking around, Scott. Use the fucking snowman."

Posted: Jan 13 2009 09:25 am

I just hate when things are dumbed down and all encompassing to everyone. I can't imagine a lot of game makers going for this. If they spend the time to make something challenging and engaging, why would they allow people to just skim right through it and not play it the way they intended? Seems to me that it's shitting on the quality and effort put into the game. Not to mention bragging rights go straight out the window for people who play the game.

Title: Comic Author Joined: Dec 12 2008 Posts: 1179

sidewaydriver wrote:

I just hate when things are dumbed down and all encompassing to everyone. I can't imagine a lot of game makers going for this. If they spend the time to make something challenging and engaging, why would they allow people to just skim right through it and not play it the way they intended? Seems to me that it's shitting on the quality and effort put into the game. Not to mention bragging rights go straight out the window for people who play the game.

The hints aren't a forced thing, though. If you don't want to use them, you simply don't use them. Bragging rights are still there just as much as they are for any other game, possibly even more so now since the hints are so readily available, saying you got through a challenging game without using the hints that are at your fingertips is just as good as saying you got through, say, Chrono Trigger without needing a guidebook.. This is all a part of Nintendo's reaching out to every kind of gamer out there. Not every gamer out there is hardcore any more, some casual gamers wouldn't mind having a hint/walkthrough system like this. I don't really see it as shitting on the game's quality, I see it as allowing more people to enjoy their game all the way through to the end, as opposed to getting stuck somewhere and putting the game away. (This goes for parts that are physically challenging in addition to complex puzzles, I've never played through to the end of Jak III because of a particular escort mission that I've never been able to beat).

Joined: Sep 17 2007 Location: The Opium Trail Posts: 3475

They could start by toning down the ridiculous AI difficulty on Mario Kart Wii. Bastards.

Honestly, after the epic fail that was Wii Music, I think Nintendo should focus less on legitamizing itself to non-gamers and focusing more and making it hardcore enough to bitchslap even the most ardent anti-Nintendo fanboys.

Posted: Jan 13 2009 01:20 pm

JRA wrote:

They could start by toning down the ridiculous AI difficulty on Mario Kart Wii. Bastards.

Honestly, after the epic fail that was Wii Music, I think Nintendo should focus less on legitamizing itself to non-gamers and focusing more and making it hardcore enough to bitchslap even the most ardent anti-Nintendo fanboys.

Make the best Mario game that they can develop with no gimmicks(No beach settings, or space settings), have a wide variety of worlds to offer like Super Mario 64 did. Hell, even just a remake of Super Mario 64 with Galaxy graphics and the return of all the SMB3 suits and the Koopalings would be godly.

Posted: Jan 13 2009 01:58 pm

Yeah, uh, Yahoo sucks for game news. Here's a more detailed explanation: http://kotaku.com/5127251/nintendo-kind-code-patent-reveals-potential-paradigm-shift-in-design

So I'm gonna cross post what I said on another forum about this:

Well, it's only an option, that can be turned off, so it doesn't interrupt my play experience. Therefore, I don't give a shit.

Title: Naunie Joined: Dec 07 2008 Posts: 1026

Mr. Bomberman wrote:

Yeah, uh, Yahoo sucks for game news. Here's a more detailed explanation: http://kotaku.com/5127251/nintendo-kind-code-patent-reveals-potential-paradigm-shift-in-design

So I'm gonna cross post what I said on another forum about this:

Well, it's only an option, that can be turned off, so it doesn't interrupt my play experience. Therefore, I don't give a shit.

True dat good sir.

Posted: Jan 13 2009 02:06 pm

Ba‘al wrote:

Make the best Mario game that they can develop with no gimmicks(No beach settings, or space settings), have a wide variety of worlds to offer like Super Mario 64 did. Hell, even just a remake of Super Mario 64 with Galaxy graphics and the return of all the SMB3 suits and the Koopalings would be godly.

Keep dreaming.....while that WOULD be absolutely incredible.

Title: Naunie Joined: Dec 07 2008 Posts: 1026

Better yet, lets make this generation of gamers play the old school Sierra adventure games,
let's see them get through those without any help.

Posted: Jan 13 2009 02:27 pm

Hey I was a King's Quest Addict at one point

Posted: Jan 13 2009 03:30 pm

I know it's optional and all but it's just the fact that Nintendo is so casual these days. Their target is people who don't play a lot of games and this is just more catering to that demographic. Eventually they are going to move further and further into that direction. This is why there is so much shovelware on the Wii that we all gripe about, it's because they come up with a simple gimmick and the casual players have no idea what's good and they buy the crap. Bored housewives might think Jenga on the Wii sounds like fun after they get done playing Wii Fit. I'll be the first to admit that I am elitist when it comes to things I like but I really think it's only going to get worse.

Joined: Dec 06 2007 Location: Connecticut Posts: 11244

If it were an overlay offered by the Wii and not something with the games themselves... ok fine.

I just don't want developers to take the time to design this type of crap.

Posted: Jan 13 2009 05:32 pm

Arlock41 wrote:

Better yet, lets make this generation of gamers play the old school Sierra adventure games,
let's see them get through those without any help.

Holy shit that one point in King's Quest V where you are trapped in the forest. You have to put the succession of emeralds down on the ground and a little elf comes to get it.

The third time, the elf gets stuck in the honey you have to drop, and finally agrees to help Graham out of the forest. He leads Graham into his underground home and gives him a pair of shoes. Graham can then finally leave the god damned forest.

That part was imposssssssssible to figure out.

Posted: Jan 13 2009 09:45 pm

I just think there's no sense of challenge if there's a hint or way around it right there available to you. Back in the day, I build my skill up because there were parts that I had to work on getting through. I just think something like this, depending on its usage, makes game playing more frivolous, but then again, I usually like games for challenge.

Posted: Jan 13 2009 10:36 pm

Well technically you always have hints at your fingertips with places like gamefaqs. Back in our day internet wasn't big and no one heard of gamefaqs yet. We figured our own shit out and we gloated.

Posted: Jan 13 2009 11:02 pm

I didn't even know cheat codes existed until I finally bought one of them gaming magazines, and this was at the time when I had both an N64 and PS1.

Posted: Jan 13 2009 11:35 pm

See, I just see this as a step to a lot of video games being dumbed down to the point the industry has a bad crash. That is what I foresee. But, I figured something like this would have happened sooner or later.

Title: Comic Author Joined: Dec 12 2008 Posts: 1179

I still don't see how this is 'dumbing down' video games. How is this any different from having places like gamefaqs available to go to? Adventure games have had hints systems in them for years, this is just an extension of that. Will games be less challenging because you have the option of an in-game hint/walkthrough system? Just having the walkthrough in game, that's going to make them purposefully make the challenges and puzzles easier? I see it as going the opposite way, allowing the designers to make the challenges and puzzles that much harder, allowing the hardcore gamers to tough it out for themselves, and the more casual gamers to get help when they need it.

Posted: Jan 13 2009 11:46 pm

I see this as a step towards that because eventually, it won't just be an optional tutorial like that. They will make it easier "in order to hook nongamers" and have a tutorial like that, or worse. I can totally see games suffering from that. (FFMQ anyone?) and it won't be soon after that that the gamers will lose faith and the industry will suffer.

But what do I know?

Posted: Jan 14 2009 01:12 am

One thing related, I just wish they'd stop FORCING you go to through tutorials. It pisses me off, even when playing the game for the first time in most cases. If somebody don't want to learn how to play the game through the instruction manual or otherwise, then they can suffer. But with this new idea, they can still get through the game without learning. Yes, there's GameFAQs, but I just don't like the psychological effects that this sort of gaming ease has on children. I want my kids to play games, but if they have anything like that in it, I'll be pissed. Overcoming challenges on your own builds character and is a great technique for learning, I feel, and the ability to bypass any challenge at any time (especially in this case, where you don't even have to learn how to do it necessarily, you can just go to the next part and never worry about it again) really puts a damper on skill development within games.

At least with GameFAQs, you have to apply read tactics to teh game and see how it gets you through (at least to some extent).

EDIT: And besides, the game should be thoroughly enjoyable enough to engage the gamer to completing said challenges on their own. The lessing of this will take a lot of pressure off game developers, and that's the last thing we need in this era.