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Valdronius
Moderator
Title: SydLexia COO
Joined: Aug 22 2005
Location: The Great White North
Posts: 4465
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I think I've heard that one before NS. I don't think I was satisfied with the solution though.
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| Klimbatize wrote: |
| A Hispanic dude living in Arizona knows a lot of Latinas? That's fucking odd. |
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Not Sure
Too Good At 2D Games
Title: Master of the Universe
Joined: Dec 03 2007
Posts: 1767
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AtmanRyu
Title: The Wandering Dragon
Joined: Jun 25 2009
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 986
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I'll be daring this time:
Is it... Blue?
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Dr. Jeebus
Moderator
Title: SLF Harbinger of Death
Joined: Sep 03 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
Posts: 5228
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I'm not sure what their reasoning is, but I'm pretty sure the answer has to be blue (And that they were probably all wearing blue hats). While I'm sure this will sound more like a guess than an answer, since they know there is at least one blue hot and there's no guarantee that there are any white ones at all, there's no way for any of them to logically deduce that their wearing a white hat. Also, it would be impossible for there to be 2 white hats as that would make the 3rd person answer immediately.
I'm curious what the answer/rational is, but I gotta sway they're all wearing blue hats.
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dr.jeebus.sydlexia.com - Updated sometimes, but on hiatus!
| UsaSatsui wrote: |
| The three greatest heels in history...Andy Kaufman, Triple H, and Dr. Jeebus |
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Not Sure
Too Good At 2D Games
Title: Master of the Universe
Joined: Dec 03 2007
Posts: 1767
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You're on to something, but you're not quite there. You're right about the 2 white hats scenario, and I'm sure the sages, being as wise as they are, considered this as well. Now take it a few steps further.
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My Youtube Channel | 2012 NES Challenge standings
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Optimist With Doubts
Title: Titlating
Joined: Dec 17 2007
Posts: 5042
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It has to be blue, the answer is in the riddle. Since the wisemen sit for so long they obviously are each staring at the same thing : Two wisemen with blue hats.
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Not Sure
Too Good At 2D Games
Title: Master of the Universe
Joined: Dec 03 2007
Posts: 1767
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Dr. Jeebus
Moderator
Title: SLF Harbinger of Death
Joined: Sep 03 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
Posts: 5228
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| Not Sure wrote: |
| Still not quite enough explanation. Consider the 1 white hat scenario. |
If one of them saw another sage with a white hat he would immediately know that his was blue, otherwise the 3rd sage would've seen 2 white hats and immediately known that his was blue.
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dr.jeebus.sydlexia.com - Updated sometimes, but on hiatus!
| UsaSatsui wrote: |
| The three greatest heels in history...Andy Kaufman, Triple H, and Dr. Jeebus |
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Not Sure
Too Good At 2D Games
Title: Master of the Universe
Joined: Dec 03 2007
Posts: 1767
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Correct. Though it would be a tad more delayed than immediate.
I guess we have our answer. The hat has to be blue.
If there are 2 white hats, the sage wearing the blue hat will know immediately and be awarded the job.
If there is 1 white hat, as Jeebus said, either of the 2 sages who happened to see the white hat would shortly realize their own hat color after the other hasn't immediately announced his own, not having seen 2 white hats.
But because so much time has passed, the 1 white hat scenario can be dismissed, so long as we assume the sages are smart enough to grasp these possibilities. Hence, we can conclude that all 3 sages must be donning blue hats.
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My Youtube Channel | 2012 NES Challenge standings
"If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe." |
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AtmanRyu
Title: The Wandering Dragon
Joined: Jun 25 2009
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 986
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Kinda decided to review why I thought blue was the answer, and while it might be a stretch, I think it's because it measures on the hesitation of the other two guys:
A 1 blue - 2 white situation is more that unlikely, since the person who sees two white hats will deduce immediately that he's wearing the blue hat.
A 2 blue - 1 white situation will have two sages looking at 1 white hat and 1 blue hat, while the third one will be looking at two blue hats. Said person will lock himself in deep thought, since he'll be gambling the possibility that he's wearing either white or blue and will have to resort to guessing. At this point, either of the first two sages who notice this from the third might be able to deduce (based on the situation given above, but inversed) that there's the possibility that they'll be wearing blue, so it'd be a matter of which one of these two sages will speak first.
Now, in a 3 blue hats situation, it means all three will be seeing 2 blue hats, thus forcing them to think this throughly, since merely guessing the answer is out of the question. At this point, the one sage in the riddle will have to deduce that this is the only scenario that would force all three of them to deep silence based on the first two situations given before it, thus leading him to give his answer.
Hmm, this should be a really interesting thing to do in real life when you think about it...
Edit: Goddamn, you beat me to it...
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Not Sure
Too Good At 2D Games
Title: Master of the Universe
Joined: Dec 03 2007
Posts: 1767
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Valdronius
Moderator
Title: SydLexia COO
Joined: Aug 22 2005
Location: The Great White North
Posts: 4465
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Ok, not the same riddle I heard. That's pretty airtight.
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| Klimbatize wrote: |
| A Hispanic dude living in Arizona knows a lot of Latinas? That's fucking odd. |
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Not Sure
Too Good At 2D Games
Title: Master of the Universe
Joined: Dec 03 2007
Posts: 1767
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This one's a lot harder, but it also involves sages and hats.
I changed it a little bit.
The Judgment of the Council of Sages proceeds as follows: the king arranges 100 sages in a line and places either a white hat, black hat, or red hat on each sage's head. Each sage can see the color of the hats of all the sages in front of him, but not of his own hat or of the hats of the sages behind him. Then one by one, starting with the sage in the back (who can see every hat but his own), each of them guesses a color. Afterward, the king executes those sages who did not correctly guess the color of their own hat.
The day before, the Council meets and decides to minimize the number of executions. What is the smallest number of sages guaranteed to survive in this case and what is the strategy they come up with?
Remember, they may only state one of the colors on their turn and cannot do anything outside of that which may indicate what they see in front of them. Also, it's important to know that every sage will be able to hear the guess of another.
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My Youtube Channel | 2012 NES Challenge standings
"If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe." |
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Dr. Jeebus
Moderator
Title: SLF Harbinger of Death
Joined: Sep 03 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
Posts: 5228
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#edit: I misread the test. Nevermind.
Worst case scenario, the smallest number that can survive is 50. The person at the end of the line would say the color of the hat on the person in front of him, thus ensuring that person's survival. Then, the 98th person would say the color of the person in front of him, etc. Starting with the very last person, every other one would be executed. I'm not sure if there's a better solution, but that's the first that comes to mind.
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dr.jeebus.sydlexia.com - Updated sometimes, but on hiatus!
| UsaSatsui wrote: |
| The three greatest heels in history...Andy Kaufman, Triple H, and Dr. Jeebus |
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Not Sure
Too Good At 2D Games
Title: Master of the Universe
Joined: Dec 03 2007
Posts: 1767
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Valdronius
Moderator
Title: SydLexia COO
Joined: Aug 22 2005
Location: The Great White North
Posts: 4465
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(I'm going to refer to the sage at the back of the line as #1)
If #1 looks at 2 and 3 and they have different coloured hats, we'll say white and black, then he says "red" which neither are wearing. #2, seeing 3's black hat, knows that his hat must be white, and says so. This cues #3 that his is white, which he says.
If 2 and three had the same color hat (i.e., red), #1 says "red" again. #2, seeing 3's red hat, knows that his is also red, and says so. This tell #3 that his is also red.
At worst, 34 sages die.
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| Klimbatize wrote: |
| A Hispanic dude living in Arizona knows a lot of Latinas? That's fucking odd. |
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Not Sure
Too Good At 2D Games
Title: Master of the Universe
Joined: Dec 03 2007
Posts: 1767
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Valdronius
Moderator
Title: SydLexia COO
Joined: Aug 22 2005
Location: The Great White North
Posts: 4465
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I know, I was about to edit to say I was working on it. Give me a minute to type it out.
EDIT:
#1 is going to be looking at 2, 3, and 4. We have to examine 5 cases. (I will put a theoretical set up in parenthesis)
a) All three hats are the same (RRR). #1 says "red". #2, seeing 2 red hats in front of him, knows his is also red. #3 Hearing 2 reds and seeing a red in front of him also says red. #4 in turn says red.
b) All three hats different (RBW). #1 says "red". #2 seeing no red hats in front of him, realizes that all hats are different and says red. #3 sees a white hat and hearing two reds know this means all the same or all different, so he says black. #4 says white.
c) Two and One, #2 different (RWW). #1 says "black". #2 seeing two white hats knows if his hat was white, he would have heard "white", so he knows his is the opposite and says "red". #3 knows that they aren't all wearing black, and aren't all different (else #2 wouldve said "black"), so seeing white, he knows he is also white. #4 also says white.
d) Two and One, #3 different (RWR). #1 says "white". #2 then knows his hat is not black, (scenario b). Seeing white and red ahead of him, he know his hat is the opposite of what was said, as says "red". #3 hearing different colors knows that all hats are not the same, and are not all different. He know he is the odd man out, red ahead and red behind, so as the initial cue was white, he is white. #4 states his color red.
e) Two and One, #4 different (RRW). #1 again says "white". By the same logic as in d, #2 knows he is red. #3 again know it is a two and one situation. He knows that #4 is the odd man out this time, or else "black" would have been said by #1. Therefore he knows he is red. #4 knows he is the odd man out, and picks the initial color, white.
At worst, 25 sages die.
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| Klimbatize wrote: |
| A Hispanic dude living in Arizona knows a lot of Latinas? That's fucking odd. |
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Not Sure
Too Good At 2D Games
Title: Master of the Universe
Joined: Dec 03 2007
Posts: 1767
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You think a lot like I do... you have pretty much the same strategies I came up with when I first saw this problem. But I admit I never got the best answer though. And there is indeed a better answer yet.
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My Youtube Channel | 2012 NES Challenge standings
"If you wish to make an apple pie from scratch, you must first invent the universe." |
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Dr. Jeebus
Moderator
Title: SLF Harbinger of Death
Joined: Sep 03 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
Posts: 5228
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The king arranges 100 sages in a line. The 100 sages then bumrush the single king. I'd be surprised if the king takes out 3 of them before being killed.
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dr.jeebus.sydlexia.com - Updated sometimes, but on hiatus!
| UsaSatsui wrote: |
| The three greatest heels in history...Andy Kaufman, Triple H, and Dr. Jeebus |
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username
Title: owner of a lonely heart
Joined: Jul 06 2007
Location: phoenix, az usa
Posts: 16136
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what if the sage is color blind?
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| Klimbatize wrote: |
| I'll eat a turkey sandwich while blowing my load |
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Valdronius
Moderator
Title: SydLexia COO
Joined: Aug 22 2005
Location: The Great White North
Posts: 4465
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| Dr. Jeebus wrote: |
| The king arranges 100 sages in a line. The 100 sages then bumrush the single king. I'd be surprised if the king takes out 3 of them before being killed. |
You've never tried to attack the King in Ultima.
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| Klimbatize wrote: |
| A Hispanic dude living in Arizona knows a lot of Latinas? That's fucking odd. |
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username
Title: owner of a lonely heart
Joined: Jul 06 2007
Location: phoenix, az usa
Posts: 16136
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| Valdronius wrote: |
| Dr. Jeebus wrote: |
| The king arranges 100 sages in a line. The 100 sages then bumrush the single king. I'd be surprised if the king takes out 3 of them before being killed. |
You've never tried to attack the King in Ultima. |
didnt some guy get banned for killing lord british? im assuming thats what you're referring to
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| Klimbatize wrote: |
| I'll eat a turkey sandwich while blowing my load |
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Blackout
Title: Captain Oblivious
Joined: Sep 01 2007
Location: That Rainy State
Posts: 10376
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The title of this thread tempted me to make this. I hereby officially apologize.
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Ghandi
Title: Alexz Aficionado
Joined: May 21 2008
Posts: 2889
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I've got a random one.
What happens if you drive your truck at the speed of light and turn your headlights on?
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