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NES + HD TV?


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Syd Lexia
Site Admin
Title: Pop Culture Junkie
Joined: Jul 30 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
PostPosted: Sep 07 2010 07:47 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I recently hooked my NES up to an HD TV and I noticed it looks like crap. All fuzzy and shit, like I'm playing it on a dying CRT. Is there any way to fix this?
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bassguy252
Title: Professional Malcontent
Joined: May 26 2010
Location: Mount Dhoom!!!!!!!
PostPosted: Sep 07 2010 08:15 pm Reply with quote Back to top

you have a few options

- sit further away from the TV

- you could try investing money in an HD Upconverter but those are pricey

- try adjusting the image quality on the TV itself like play around with the sharpness and the contrast and set the TV to DVD viewing

hrmmm otherwise if your computer can plug into your TV you could always just use an emulator since the computer sends a digital signal the quality of the image wont be reduced on an HD TV... at least I think it should work, I havent tried it... hrmmm perhaps I shall


Let's assume it's a mixture of the two!


 
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Syd Lexia
Site Admin
Title: Pop Culture Junkie
Joined: Jul 30 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
PostPosted: Sep 07 2010 08:28 pm Reply with quote Back to top

bassguy252 wrote:
sit further away from the TV

That doesn't change the fact that the quality is shit. Standing 10 feet away from an ugly girl at all times doesn't make her any less ugly or any easier to date.
Quote:
you could try investing money in an HD Upconverter but those are pricey

Explain further, as this is the only good option you've offered.
Quote:
try adjusting the image quality on the TV itself like play around with the sharpness and the contrast and set the TV to DVD viewing

Tried that.
Quote:
hrmmm otherwise if your computer can plug into your TV you could always just use an emulator since the computer sends a digital signal the quality of the image wont be reduced on an HD TV

Except for a couple things:

1. I have an actual NES
2. My computer isn't right next to me TV, because that's a stupid place to put a computer, and I don't want wires everywhere.

I think I'm going to wait until GPF, Douche, or Knyte replies. Your first suggestion was so incredibly stupid that I am doubtful you know what you're talking about.
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Valdronius
Moderator
Title: SydLexia COO
Joined: Aug 22 2005
Location: The Great White North
PostPosted: Sep 07 2010 08:35 pm Reply with quote Back to top

That's weird. When I played my NES on an HDTV, the graphics went to 16-bit


Klimbatize wrote:
A Hispanic dude living in Arizona knows a lot of Latinas? That's fucking odd.

 
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UsaSatsui
Title: The White Rabbit
Joined: May 25 2008
Location: Hiding
PostPosted: Sep 07 2010 09:10 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I'd like to say I knew that was going on, but I don't. I have heard this can be an issue, though.

How are you connecting it? RF or AV cables? If the former, I'd try the latter out, it may work better (if you can -find- Monaural AV cables...)
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Douche McCallister
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Title: DOO-SHAY
Joined: Jan 26 2007
Location: Private Areas
PostPosted: Sep 07 2010 09:18 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Definitely use AV cables if your not already. I had my NES hooked up to my HDTV and I noticed no loss in quality compared to my roommates CRT. Other than that maybe you need glasses? I haven't encountered this problem since getting a tv with AV inputs in the late 90's.


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Syd Lexia
Site Admin
Title: Pop Culture Junkie
Joined: Jul 30 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
PostPosted: Sep 07 2010 09:33 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I'm using the white and red AV cables. No RF switch. I'll take a picture later.
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bassguy252
Title: Professional Malcontent
Joined: May 26 2010
Location: Mount Dhoom!!!!!!!
PostPosted: Sep 07 2010 10:13 pm Reply with quote Back to top

No need to be rude Razz this is a major problem for many people, the fact is, old technology and new technology arent very compatible, there is no grand solution to your problem.

It would be like getting a brand new computer to run Commander Keen... hell my computer wont even run diablo 1

But here I found this for you on what an Upconverter does

http://electronics.howstuffworks.com/hd-upconverter.htm

An HD upconverter is a device that solves two problems, both of which are due to the collision of old technology with new technology. The analog signal still present in a lot of our electronics is colliding with the all-digital developments that now control the electronics industry.

An upconverter allows the digital information stored on a DVD to be transmitted directly to a hi-definition TV without ever having to be converted to an analog signal. An upconverter also takes the lower screen resolution on most DVDs and "upconverts" it to the higher resolutions offered by HDTVs.


They are kinda pricey, if you dont mind shelling out a few hundred bucks to play your Nes on an HD TV thats probably the easiest option

but then if your spending that much money you might as well just buy a Wii and get all the classic games off of their network.


Let's assume it's a mixture of the two!


 
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Andrew Man
Title: Is a Funklord
Joined: Jan 30 2007
Location: Annandale, VA
PostPosted: Sep 07 2010 11:33 pm Reply with quote Back to top

The future is so brutal!!!


My Muzaks! CHECK IT OUT!!!
http://www.facebook.com/hellodharmaband

3DS is very good, and Wii U!

 
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The Opponent
Title: Forum Battle WINNER
Joined: Feb 24 2010
Location: The Danger Zone
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 12:55 am Reply with quote Back to top

I bet there's a mod for connecting a component output on actual NES hardware.


I'm not a bad enough dude, but I am an edgy little shit. I'll do what I can.
 
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Andrew Man
Title: Is a Funklord
Joined: Jan 30 2007
Location: Annandale, VA
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 01:03 am Reply with quote Back to top

The-Excel wrote:
I bet there's a mod for connecting a component output on actual NES hardware.


I am sure, there is pretty much a mod for everything these days.


My Muzaks! CHECK IT OUT!!!
http://www.facebook.com/hellodharmaband

3DS is very good, and Wii U!

 
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UsaSatsui
Title: The White Rabbit
Joined: May 25 2008
Location: Hiding
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 01:38 am Reply with quote Back to top

bassguy252 wrote:
It would be like getting a brand new computer to run Commander Keen... hell my computer wont even run diablo 1

My computer runs Commander Keen just fine.

DosBox. Learn it, live it, love it.

Anyways, this is one of those "is it turned on" questions, but are sure you're plugged into the right inputs?
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Andrew Man
Title: Is a Funklord
Joined: Jan 30 2007
Location: Annandale, VA
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 01:42 am Reply with quote Back to top

UsaSatsui wrote:
...but are sure you're plugged into the right inputs?


That's what she said??


My Muzaks! CHECK IT OUT!!!
http://www.facebook.com/hellodharmaband

3DS is very good, and Wii U!

 
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Pandajuice
Title: The Power of Grayskull
Joined: Oct 30 2008
Location: US and UK
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 05:39 am Reply with quote Back to top

Isn't this why most collectors keep old TV sets around to hook up to the older consoles?
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Thunderhorse
Title: This is DELICIOUS!
Joined: Dec 29 2009
Location: Colorado Springs, CO
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 05:54 am Reply with quote Back to top

My SNES works fine with my HDTV. I connect through the cable line too. Of course I still have to change the screen size from widescreen to...uhh...non-widescreen. Is that your problem, Syd? I don't have an NES to check with, but I'm assuming it's the same.

It might also have to do with the brand and age of your HDTV. I have a Samsung that's about two and a half years old.


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This Is Tuna With Bacon
 
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Doddsino
Joined: Oct 01 2009
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 06:03 am Reply with quote Back to top

My NES works just fine on my HDTV, with 2 exceptions;

1. The light gun doesn't work on it.

2. I played North and South on it twice, and both times it blew the speakers.
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GPFontaine
Joined: Dec 06 2007
Location: Connecticut
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 07:48 am Reply with quote Back to top

Syd,

First, don't expect digital graphics that you see on your computer. You will never get them. You are viewing an analog video signal that is being converted into a digital one. The best you will see is going to be upconverted quality.

My television has a little bit of signal cleaning as an option. It does a fair job, but games downloaded on the Wii look much better.

Pushing the signal through my upconverting AV Receiver does help. In general the image does get cleaned a bit. If this is an option for you, definitely take advantage of it.

They sell analog video cleaning boxes, but they usually cost more than a Wii & the game you want.
$400:
http://www.amazon.com/Canopus-ADVC300-Advanced-Digital-Converter/dp/B0006UMGHE

Lastly, make sure you are viewing the image at 4:3 ratio. If you have it at 16:9/16:10 it will be further distorted.

What brand and model TV do you have?



 
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FNJ
2010 SLF Tag Champ
Joined: Jun 07 2006
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 09:32 am Reply with quote Back to top

God DAMN, syd!

Do you want a hug?

Also, I have had this trouble as well. I was unaware of this digital upcomverter box. It sounds more reasonable than my original idea to have an HD tv wall mounted over a CRT tv. I will have to look into this.

Also, my computer is next to my tv. It's great for having friends over for mugen or watching movies that i'vs downloaded. It's also not a bad idea for LAN parties. What's so bad about that?


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GPFontaine
Joined: Dec 06 2007
Location: Connecticut
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 11:45 am Reply with quote Back to top

Syd seems to own one single 15 year old computer. I doubt his family would be up for him doing the entertainment system thing with it... and the VGA output would look yucky on a 1080p screen.



 
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Syd Lexia
Site Admin
Title: Pop Culture Junkie
Joined: Jul 30 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 12:20 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I have my own computer. It is on the opposite end if my room from the TV. That way, I can actually watch TV while computing. My current computer is 6 years old. I was going to buy a new over Labor Day, but I spent too much money this month.

I'll get you the make and model later. It's the Best Buy house brand. Insignia, I think?

And yes, of course I run it 4:3 mode.

And yes, I do want a hug.
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Ash Burton
Title: AshRaiser
Joined: Nov 10 2008
Location: Florida
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 02:20 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Syd, I had the same problem. You will also notice that some Super Nintendo systems will flicker and jump on the screen. The best solution I can give is what I did, go pick up a newer, nice CRT (Sony WEGA is what I use) and create yourself a little retro gaming station. I have my Wii, PS2, PS3 and Gamecube hooked up to the HDTV, and the retro consoles hooked up to my CRT. You can pick up a nice one with a stand for around 75 bucks:

http://boston.craigslist.org/gbs/ele/1942672096.html


Image

joshwoodzy wrote:
Ash is probably just home humping his SNES collection.

 
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Syd Lexia
Site Admin
Title: Pop Culture Junkie
Joined: Jul 30 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 02:26 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I have a small CRT right now. Probably 12", maybe 14. Wish I had room for something bigger.
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GPFontaine
Joined: Dec 06 2007
Location: Connecticut
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 02:40 pm Reply with quote Back to top

It would be awesome if a NES could be modded for digital output. I would pay for a kit that allowed for Component/HDMI output.



 
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Syd Lexia
Site Admin
Title: Pop Culture Junkie
Joined: Jul 30 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 03:25 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Here's what it looks like on my TV:



This is pretty much exactly what I'm seeing. Notice in particular how the text looks "fuzzy".

Television is an Insiginia NS-L32Q-10A.

It has a "noise reduction" option under picture, but it doesn't seem to actually do anything. I tried turning down the sharpness and playing around with the contrast. That didn't help either.
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Knyte
2010 SLF Tag Champ*
Title: Curator Of The VGM
Joined: Nov 01 2006
Location: Here I am.
PostPosted: Sep 08 2010 04:32 pm Reply with quote Back to top

The problem is with the NES and not the TV.

The standard display resolution of the NES is 256 horizontal pixels by 240 vertical pixels. Typically, games designed for NTSC-based systems had an effective resolution of only 256 by 224 pixels, as the top and bottom 8 scanlines are not visible on most television sets.

Your TV (Insiginia NS-L32Q-10A) has a native resolution of 1366 x 768. Which means it has to stretch the vertical pixels by 3.2X. They are going to look like crap. There is nothing you can do to change that on the NES hardware level. The only way it is going to look better is if it is run through an emulator that can enhance the graphics output using Interpolation, Eagle Engine, 2xSAI and such.

CRT TVs were not only low resolution (vertical frame resolution of 480 lines), but they also had scanlines, which skipped every other horizonal line of resolution. So earlier digital game products took this into account with their video outputs. Modern HD doesn't have scanlines and such. It pastes exactly what the console puts out. Unfortunately, this shows the nuances of the old console video tricks.
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