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Spider-Man 3 (and overall franchise)


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FNJ
2010 SLF Tag Champ
Joined: Jun 07 2006
PostPosted: Apr 09 2007 03:05 pm Reply with quote Back to top

ChildrenofSlayer wrote:
Mario Brothers film >>> Spiderman series

you deserve to be shot for saying this.


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ChildrenofSlayer
Joined: Mar 24 2007
PostPosted: Apr 09 2007 08:17 pm Reply with quote Back to top

JEW wrote:


you deserve to be shot for saying this.


You deserve to be flailed to the bone, have all your fingernails pulled out, stretched a few inches on the rack, be chemically castrated, get butchered by an axe murder, and have your corpse eaten for taking "Spiderman" over "The Mario Brothers".

I don't mind anyone saying the Mario film sucked, or even that it was the worst fucking film of all time, but worse than Spiderman? Are you kidding me?

Before your post, I thought the only people who watched and enjoyed the Spiderman film series were teenage girls. I'm serious. I had never met a straight guy who considered either film good, let alone great.

The films had all the plot ingenuity and intelligence of Barney cartoons mixed with the pretentious, repetitive boredom of Raimi's attempts at serious dialouge. ("With great power comes great responsibility" was repeated a thousand times throughout the film....how has this not been made into a Brokeback parody yet?)

To summarize, I usually couldn't give a flying fuck what films people like, but I make exceptions for two special types of assholes;

people who liked Star Wars Episode 3,

and people who enjoyed the Spiderman series.
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Mr. Bomberman
2009 Forum Champion
Title: (still) token black.
Joined: Jan 27 2006
Location: Home of the lost towers
PostPosted: Apr 09 2007 08:20 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I liked the Spiderman movies, and, I'm looking forward to the 3rd one myself...


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Tishwitch
Title: PornStarExtraordinaire
Joined: Jul 01 2006
Location: Winter Wonderland
PostPosted: Apr 09 2007 08:27 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I didn't care for Spiderman, maybe it was cuz Kirsten Dunst's constant lack of bra distracted me, or Toby McGuire's extreme effeminate attitude, or the semi-crappy graphics... maybe all of it. Not a fan.

This summer of sequels will be lead by Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End, I'm 99% certain.


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ChildrenofSlayer
Joined: Mar 24 2007
PostPosted: Apr 09 2007 08:33 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Mr. Bomberman wrote:
I liked the Spiderman movies, and, I'm looking forward to the 3rd one myself...


Okay, serious question;

what aspects of the movie did you enjoy? Was it the hype of a beloved franchise you worshipped as a kid being made into a big-time movie with badass villians? The kickass CGI and action sequences? Toby Maguire and/or that annoying girl from "Crazy Beautiful"?? (I refuse to address her by her real name)

I mean, I really have to figure this out. I understand why people like(d) Britney Spears, Nelly Furtado, Fergie, etc., even if such tastes were/are morally repugnant to me. But I haven't deciphered either "Star Wars 6" or "Spiderman". Help me out, man.
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Cattivo
Joined: Apr 14 2006
Location: Lake Michigan
PostPosted: Apr 09 2007 09:38 pm Reply with quote Back to top

The Spider-Man movies may be overrated, but they're not bad by any means.

That said, I hate the comic book approach they took to the Spider-Man series instead of the realistic approach they took on X-Men and Batman Begins. When you adapt something for film, alterations must be made so that it fits that world. Otherwise, you can't attain a serious tone and you just end up with a cheesy movie.

Plus, the romance story dominated the plot. Batman Begins did the smart thing by having Rachel Dawes play a more minor role. Super Hero movies are predominately for a male audience. We don't want to see the drama that a relationship entails, just a good storyline that includes the hero kicking ass. Besides, Dunst was horribly miscast as MJ. At least Molina made a good Doc Ock though.

I am looking forward to the third movie, as it looks darker. While I'm a fan of Raimi, I'm sure he'll find a way to put cheesy dialogue in it and an oversaturation of romance still though. Damnit, where's my Evil Dead remake instead?
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Mr. Bomberman
2009 Forum Champion
Title: (still) token black.
Joined: Jan 27 2006
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PostPosted: Apr 09 2007 09:40 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Since I'm too lazy to post my opinion, I'll agree with Cattivo...

...also the fights were awesome.

edit: and Tebor.


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ChildrenofSlayer
Joined: Mar 24 2007
PostPosted: Apr 09 2007 09:59 pm Reply with quote Back to top

So far, several posters have given perfectly credible reasons to dislike the film. (Cattivo, Tish)

However, I'm looking for reasons why people liked them. It can be the most abstract and intellectual response ("the conceit and agnorisis of the protaganist's epic struggle underscores the angst, futility, and impersonality of the modern world") or the silliest reason ever. ("It had a flying spider kicking bad guy butt, tee hee!")

I just want to see it from your perspective(s), gentlemen.
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Tebor
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Title: Master of the Universe
Joined: Aug 22 2005
Location: Gotham City
PostPosted: Apr 09 2007 10:22 pm Reply with quote Back to top

I'm in Bomberman's realm. Too lazy to actually respond to some of these posts.

My overall, down-and-dirty thoughts of the Spider-Man films:

Spider-Man 1 - Loved it. Great. Throwback to "Darkman".
Spider–Man 2 - Not so much. Too many people find out Spidey's secret for my tastes. Throwback to "Evil Dead 2".

Spider-Man 3 - Really looking forward to it.

More to come... possibly. That means addressing what I liked, ChildSlayer. Wink


"If you will not tell me, I will hurt people!!!" -Nuclear Man

"Do you hear? The alpha and the omega. Death and rebirth. And as you die, so will I be reborn!" - Skeletor

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Dr. Jeebus
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Title: SLF Harbinger of Death
Joined: Sep 03 2005
Location: Wakefield, MA
PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 12:59 am Reply with quote Back to top

I didn't read all of this, just accusations that only teenage girls like Spiderman. While I'm not going to claim to be the resident expert on comics and stuff as I know many other people here have read more than me, I do claim to be the resident expert on reactions to comic book movies from people who actually read comics, and both everyone I worked with and everyone that comes into the store that has seen the Spiderman movies liked them.

As for too many people finding out his identity, it's like that with most superheroes.


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Tebor
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Title: Master of the Universe
Joined: Aug 22 2005
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PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 01:23 am Reply with quote Back to top

Dr. Jeebus wrote:
As for too many people finding out his identity, it's like that with most superheroes.

Movies* Wink

I just meant the "dramatic reveal" that was played for each one. The only one I thought worked great was Harry. MJ needed to know thematically though... Doc Ock... okay, but combine it with MJ at least... The train was a nice scene and the first reveal, but in hindsight this is probably the reveal I have the biggest problem with, this and Doc Ock.


"If you will not tell me, I will hurt people!!!" -Nuclear Man

"Do you hear? The alpha and the omega. Death and rebirth. And as you die, so will I be reborn!" - Skeletor

8341 unread forum updates since I left (2/7/14)... Uh-oh.
 
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Knyte
2010 SLF Tag Champ*
Title: Curator Of The VGM
Joined: Nov 01 2006
Location: Here I am.
PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 01:34 am Reply with quote Back to top

Then don't read Civil War.



*****SPOILER!*****




















The entire world finds out who Spidey is.
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Tebor
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Title: Master of the Universe
Joined: Aug 22 2005
Location: Gotham City
PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 01:39 am Reply with quote Back to top

Knyte wrote:
*****SPOILER!*****

Ugh... I don't care who knows. I just care when a film tries to treat it as a BIG dramatic moment... Four different times! Or at least so close together. Say Harry found out earlier. MJ in the middle. Doc Ock at the end. Good fine. Cool. Spread them out!


"If you will not tell me, I will hurt people!!!" -Nuclear Man

"Do you hear? The alpha and the omega. Death and rebirth. And as you die, so will I be reborn!" - Skeletor

8341 unread forum updates since I left (2/7/14)... Uh-oh.
 
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ChildrenofSlayer
Joined: Mar 24 2007
PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 03:50 am Reply with quote Back to top

Dr. Jeebus wrote:
, and both everyone I worked with and everyone that comes into the store that has seen the Spiderman movies liked them.

So you're telling me that everyone you work with is a teenage girl? Unless they're of the fat, smelly, cosplaying persuasion, that's fucking awesome. You're a lucky man.

Focus

Obviously, everyone who enjoys a film doesn't have some complex, concrete reason they're conjuring up in their heads for why they like a film. They just flippin' do.

And most of the time, I can figure out why, whether it be the existence of Holocaust deniers, rapists, or MCs that play obnoxious rap songs at parties, even though all three disgust me to my very core.

But not with Spiderman. I just don't get it.
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Char Aznable
Title: Char Classic™
Joined: Jul 24 2006
Location: Robot Boombox HQ
PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 08:39 am Reply with quote Back to top

You seem like you have more against Spiderman than the movies.

Did Spiderman touch you inappropriately?


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Tebor
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Joined: Aug 22 2005
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PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 11:22 am Reply with quote Back to top

Char Aznable wrote:
You seem like you have more against Spiderman than the movies.

Did Spiderman touch you inappropriately?

Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing Laughing

Didn't see that coming. Rolling Eyes


"If you will not tell me, I will hurt people!!!" -Nuclear Man

"Do you hear? The alpha and the omega. Death and rebirth. And as you die, so will I be reborn!" - Skeletor

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Syd Lexia
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PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 11:52 am Reply with quote Back to top

I hate HATE HATE Toby Maguire and I wish death upon him as well as all previous and future generations of his family, but I'll give the Spider-Man movies credit where credit is due. They're well done action movies and they've done a whole lot better with the source material than most other comic book movies.
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S. McCracken
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Title: Enforcer
Joined: Aug 22 2005
Location: Massachusetts
PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 02:19 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Syd Lexia wrote:
I hate HATE HATE Toby Maguire and I wish death upon him as well as all previous and future generations of his family, but I'll give the Spider-Man movies credit where credit is due. They're well done action movies and they've done a whole lot better with the source material than most other comic book movies.


Where does this hate come from? Show me on the doll.

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Knyte
2010 SLF Tag Champ*
Title: Curator Of The VGM
Joined: Nov 01 2006
Location: Here I am.
PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 03:09 pm Reply with quote Back to top

S. McCracken wrote:
Syd Lexia wrote:
I hate HATE HATE Toby Maguire and I wish death upon him as well as all previous and future generations of his family, but I'll give the Spider-Man movies credit where credit is due. They're well done action movies and they've done a whole lot better with the source material than most other comic book movies.


Where does this hate come from? Show me on the doll.

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FNJ
2010 SLF Tag Champ
Joined: Jun 07 2006
PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 04:03 pm Reply with quote Back to top

ChildrenofSlayer wrote:
JEW wrote:
you deserve to be shot for saying this.


You deserve to be flailed to the bone, have all your fingernails pulled out, stretched a few inches on the rack, be chemically castrated, get butchered by an axe murder, and have your corpse eaten for taking "Spiderman" over "The Mario Brothers".

I don't mind anyone saying the Mario film sucked, or even that it was the worst fucking film of all time, but worse than Spiderman? Are you kidding me?

Before your post, I thought the only people who watched and enjoyed the Spiderman film series were teenage girls. I'm serious. I had never met a straight guy who considered either film good, let alone great.

The films had all the plot ingenuity and intelligence of Barney cartoons mixed with the pretentious, repetitive boredom of Raimi's attempts at serious dialouge. ("With great power comes great responsibility" was repeated a thousand times throughout the film....how has this not been made into a Brokeback parody yet?)

To summarize, I usually couldn't give a flying fuck what films people like, but I make exceptions for two special types of assholes;

people who liked Star Wars Episode 3,

and people who enjoyed the Spiderman series.



was the entire beginning of your post really nessecary?

you really must not read the comics much if you feel this strongly about the spiderman movies.

ChildrenofSlayer wrote:
Mr. Bomberman wrote:
I liked the Spiderman movies, and, I'm looking forward to the 3rd one myself...


Okay, serious question;

what aspects of the movie did you enjoy? Was it the hype of a beloved franchise you worshipped as a kid being made into a big-time movie with badass villians? The kickass CGI and action sequences? Toby Maguire and/or that annoying girl from "Crazy Beautiful"?? (I refuse to address her by her real name)

I mean, I really have to figure this out. I understand why people like(d) Britney Spears, Nelly Furtado, Fergie, etc., even if such tastes were/are morally repugnant to me. But I haven't deciphered either "Star Wars 6" or "Spiderman". Help me out, man.


you're trying waaaay too hard man. how old are you?


ChildrenofSlayer wrote:
Dr. Jeebus wrote:
, and both everyone I worked with and everyone that comes into the store that has seen the Spiderman movies liked them.

So you're telling me that everyone you work with is a teenage girl? Unless they're of the fat, smelly, cosplaying persuasion, that's fucking awesome. You're a lucky man.

Focus

Obviously, everyone who enjoys a film doesn't have some complex, concrete reason they're conjuring up in their heads for why they like a film. They just flippin' do.

And most of the time, I can figure out why, whether it be the existence of Holocaust deniers, rapists, or MCs that play obnoxious rap songs at parties, even though all three disgust me to my very core.

But not with Spiderman. I just don't get it.


so you're insulting people for enjoying a movie now? that's really mature. you must be like twelve.


I enjoyed the spiderman movies because they took a comic book that I enjoyed, and adapted it to the big screen, and didn't fuck it up. it's that simple.

they didn't redesign all of the characters to be more realistic (x-men) they didn't say "fuck it" and do whatever they wanted with the source material (AVP, resident evil apocalypse) they didn't make a standalone movie and then slap a liscense on it that didn't fit just to cash in (your beloved super mario). it was an honest to god, simply put, movie based on a comic book.

the movie was made to appeal to comic fans, not cosplayers, not manly men, not women. anyone who actually reads comic books would understand that the romance in the movie was needed, and works. Peter Parker's family has always been an important part of who he is. why else would current spiderman have killed someone after they hurt his aunt may and put his wife in danger, and now roams the city in a black outfit seeking vengance? (back in black) why else would marvel zombies spiderman become a bawling baby whenever zombie tony stark mentioned how he ate his wife and aunt? if you aren't seing the movie because you're a comic book fan, then why are you seeing it? it's like going to see titanic when you aren't the least bit interested in a love story.

the campy cheese lines have always been a big part of spiderman's dialogue in teh comics, and it wouldn't feel like spiderman if raimi didn't include it in his script. Fuck man, the entire first movie was based on a story arc that ocurred in the comics (except in the comic, gwen stacy was killed on that bridge scene at the end, as opposed to spidey saving mary jane) The things raimi did change, were subtle, and nessecary to adapt the plot, but didn't ruin it.

and on the argument of the movie not being realistic in the vein of batman begins or x-men, it's a movie based on a comic book. it's a film about a man in a costume swingign around a city fightign badguys with super powers. batman begins worked because batman has always been a darker, more serious cahracter, and x-men.... didn't work.

I'm expecting you to reply with somethign along the lines of "your stupid and I disagree with you" except with more words taht you looked up in the dictionary to sound smarter, or at least more insults or threats to do graphic things. Either that or you'll fall back on pointing out my spelling errors.


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S. McCracken
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PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 04:13 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Amen, JEW.


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ChildrenofSlayer
Joined: Mar 24 2007
PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 05:32 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Char Aznable wrote:
You seem like you have more against Spiderman than the movies.

Did Spiderman touch you inappropriately?


I, like every other little kid in the mid 90's who lived in the States, watched the Spiderman cartoon series religiously. I've also read quite a few of the comics, and played a lot of the games. I consider myself a fan, although not a huge one.

But the big screen version fucking sucked, and unlike most films that fucking suck which a lot of people nevertheless enjoy, I can't figure this one out. The "I'm too lazy" responses aren't helping me out either, folks.

JEW wrote:
so you're insulting people for enjoying a movie now? that's really mature. you must be like twelve.


It was a joke, idiot. And wait a second, didn't you insult me for liking "Super Mario Brothers" with your first post in this topic?

Does that make you a hypocrite or just plain dumb?

JEW wrote:
the movie was made to appeal to comic fans, not cosplayers, not manly men, not women. anyone who actually reads comic books would understand that the romance in the movie was needed, and works.


Oh, but that's where you're dead wrong. Girls LOVE this film. They are the single biggest demographic the studio is/was aiming for. Trust me on this.

Do you really think that Spiderman made so much money (well over $500 million) off the back of comic book fans? Do you realize what an incredibly small subset of the population that is?

Worst of all, your response didn't answer the question, beside some irrelevant mentions of current Spiderman issues and how the love story and lack of realism is necessary. I have no fucking problems with a love story and lack of realism in a movie. Besides, this isn't a question of why I hate the movie, (which I've already explained) but rather what other people like in it.

So, all I got from that long-winded, boring post was "Spiderman movies appeal to comic book fans, because it wasn't radically different from the comics".

Uh, okay. Alright, fine.....you can wipe the spittle from your foaming mouth now JEW.

To everyone else-

Honestly, this thread is becoming a little repetitive, and most of that probably has to do with my fucking repetitive questions. I actually have nothing against the fan of the films (well, unless you count my ex-girlfriend that used to be fucking obsessed with it...), and I've learned some valuable things in this topic, like the fact that comic book fans love "Spiderman", and JEW is a humorless, whiny, little geek.
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lordsathien
Title: Head of Lexian R&D
Joined: Oct 15 2005
Location: Metro area, Georgia
PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 06:29 pm Reply with quote Back to top

In Soviet Russia, Spider-Man hates YOU!


"Life is a waste of time. Time is a waste of life. Get wasted all the time, and you'll have the time of your life!"
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Cattivo
Joined: Apr 14 2006
Location: Lake Michigan
PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 09:55 pm Reply with quote Back to top

While I hate to argue on the same side as CoS because his points mainly consist of insults, here's my "Spider-Man is an ok, but not a great movie" response:

JEW wrote:
anyone who actually reads comic books would understand that the romance in the movie was needed, and works.


Yes, it was needed, but I didn't want it dominating the plot. It actually became the A story in SM2, with Doc Ock being the B story. As a guy, I want to see more of an action-filled plot than a melodramatic soap opera.


JEW wrote:
the campy cheese lines have always been a big part of spiderman's dialogue in teh comics, and it wouldn't feel like spiderman if raimi didn't include it in his script.


I usually hear that in response to my "cheesy" comments, and it's a good point. But, like I said earlier, when a comic book or any other source material is adapted for the screen, alterations must be made to make it more realistic. Cheesy banter is ok, even entertaining, in a cartoon or comic, but it's just silly in a live-action movie.

JEW wrote:
and on the argument of the movie not being realistic in the vein of batman begins or x-men, it's a movie based on a comic book. it's a film about a man in a costume swingign around a city fightign badguys with super powers. batman begins worked because batman has always been a darker, more serious cahracter, and x-men.... didn't work.


Maybe I just like darker movies, but when I see a cartoon moved onto the big screen, I just can't take it seriously. I was actually laughing out loud during SM1 when GG was giving a little speech to SM on a rooftop because Dafoe was trying to be dramatic, but he couldn't emote through that mask because it had a frozen expression. I guess it's just a personal preference, but I want super hero films to make me believe that it could really happen. Although, that does sound silly.

And I can understand the opinion that X1 and X3 didn't work, but X2 was a damn fine film. It was like Wrath of Khan was translated into an X-Men movie.

In spite of me only mentioning negative comments again, I do think the SM movies are entertaining. I just don't think they're worth buying and rewatching like the efforts of Batman Begins and X2.
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ChildrenofSlayer
Joined: Mar 24 2007
PostPosted: Apr 10 2007 10:43 pm Reply with quote Back to top

Cattivo wrote:
While I hate to argue on the same side as CoS because his points mainly consist of insults.


I'm not arguing anything here. Most arguments about films come down to someone liking a certain part and the another person hating the exact same part. No one can change another's opinion about these things. I hate "Spiderman", and I accept that there are people who like it. There's nothing to fucking argue about with regards to this; that's just the way opinions are, and it's not going to change.

However, posts about movie opinions serve a valuable purpose in expressing peoples' opinions; that is, why and what they liked or hated in a film.

I've now heard several decent explanations for why people hated the film, and one rather poor explanation for why the film was good. (It was similar to the comic)

If so many people liked Spiderman, I would expect a lot more and better reasons for why the film rocked.

Hell, I've even offered some plausible reasons in past posts.
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